After the Rapture takes place how will the world respond? Find out with Dr. David Reagan on the show Christ in Prophecy.
Last aired on Sep 14, 2014.
To order, call 1-972-736-3567 (M-F, 8 a.m.-5 p.m. CST), or select the resource below to order online.
Dr. Reagan: Greetings in the name of Jesus our Blessed Hope! I am Dave Reagan, Senior Evangelist for Lamb & Lion Ministries.
Over the past few weeks we have been talking with you about a very great prophetic event that is going to occur sometime soon, namely the rapture of the Church. In our first program we considered the meaning of the Rapture; and in that program we found that it is the biblical promise that one day soon Jesus will appear in the heavens at the shout of an archangel and the blowing of a trumpet. And when that occurs the dead and living in Christ will meet Him in the sky and return to Heaven with Him. This is the teaching of 1 Thessalonians 4 beginning with verse 13. In our second program we considered the difference between the Rapture and the Second Coming. In that program we saw that the Second Coming will be quite different from the Rapture. At the Rapture Jesus appears in the heavens, at the Second Coming He returns to earth. At the Rapture He appears as a deliverer for His Church; whereas at the Second Coming He returns as a warrior with His Church. At the Rapture Jesus appears in love as a Bridegroom coming for His Bride the Church; whereas at the Second Coming Jesus returns in glory and majesty to reign as King of kings and Lord of lords.
In our last program we took a look at the timing of the Rapture. We saw that this is a very controversial question. Some believe it will happen in the middle of the Tribulation. Some believe it will occur in conjunction with the Second Coming. We concluded from our study that the best inference of scripture is that it is most likely to occur before the Tribulation begins. In this program we are going to conclude our consideration of the Rapture by taking a look at its aftermath. In other words what will the world be like after the Rapture occurs? Let’s go to our studio where I have two prophecy experts waiting to discuss this topic.
Dr. Reagan: I’m delighted to have in the studio with me today two colleagues who are real experts on Bible prophecy. One is my associate, Dennis Pollock here at Lamb & Lion Ministries. And the other is Gary Fisher, who is the founder and director of Lion of Judah Ministries in Franklin, Tennessee. Dennis, it is always good to have you at my side.
Dennis Pollock: Well, thank you, Dave, that’s the only place I’d want to be.
Dr. Reagan: And Gary, I tell you we are really honored and privileged to have you here all the way from the great state of Tennessee.
Gary Fisher: Thank you, Dave. It is great to be here and work with you guys again.
Dr. Reagan: You know I did some research one time, Gary, and discovered that Texas was populated by people from Tennessee. Just about everybody originally settled in this state came from Tennessee. And all of them were running from the law. Now, I hope that is not your situation as you come today.
Gary Fisher: Not the case with me. Although I did run from the Lord for 20 years. I’m not running from the law.
Dr. Reagan: Well, good. I’m glad to hear that. Well, gentleman our topic is the aftermath of the Rapture. And I’d like to get into this topic by asking you a question. And the question is: Who’s going to go in the Rapture? Will it be everyone who’s on a church roll? Everybody who is a church member? Will it be some sort of super saints who maybe know something that other people don’t know, or have some gift that other people don’t have? Or will it just be say all sincere people who really are sincere about seeking the Lord? Who is going in the Rapture?
Dennis Pollock: Dave that’s a good question. You know a lot of people don’t realize that there is not a big long, long passage that gives all the definitive answers in any one place. There’s a couple good strong passages about the Rapture. But you find terms like, we who are alive and remain, in the classic 1 Thessalonians 4 passage that says, “We who are alive and remain are going to be caught up.” Well, who is the “we” Paul was talking about? Obviously he was talking about Christians; those Christians that were alive and were still around at the point of the Rapture are going to be the ones who are going to go. Jesus said I’m going to prepare a place for you. And He said, “I am going to come again.” Well a place for who? A place for you; that is the disciples. So, traditional Christian theology has always said it is going to be those that have been born again; those who belong to Jesus Christ.
Dr. Reagan: Well, that raises another question though and that is that if you were to go out in America today and ask people on the street: Are you a Christian? Eighty-five percent or more of American’s would say, “Yes.” Is 85% of Americans going out in the Rapture?
Dennis Pollock: Yeah, well, actually in Texas it would be more like 95%. I know I go out and pass out tracks and it’s hard to find someone to admit they’re not a Christian. But, yeah, you’re right a lot of people think they’re Christian, but the Bible indicates clearly you have to have a born-again experience. So, it is going to be those who have truly experienced Jesus Christ. Not just on a church roll, or necessarily making a profession but their life doesn’t show it, but it is going to be those who truly know Jesus Christ.
Dr. Reagan: Do you have anything to add to that Gary?
Gary Fisher: Well, I think one of the key scriptures to understanding this is the classic there that he started on in 1 Thessalonians verse 4:16, “For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ.” Those in Christ will go in the Rapture.
Dr. Reagan: And those are people who have been born again, both living and dead.
Gary Fisher: Yes.
Dr. Reagan: And I want to emphasize that because I have actually had people look me in the eye and say, “Well, I’m a Christian but I’m not one of those born again Christians.” Now, how do they convict themselves when they say that? Because what did Jesus say?
Dennis Pollock: Yeah.
Gary Fisher: You must be born again.
Dennis Pollock: You know I ran into a guy exactly in that situation. In fact I asked him, “Are you born again?” He said, “Well, my church doesn’t believe in being born again.” Then I confronted him with the scripture where Jesus said, “You must be born again.” Well, he couldn’t back off from that all together so he said, “Well, let’s put it this way, we don’t believe the way you believe.” Well, I just met the guy. I was out trying to tell people about Jesus. But I guess he figured anybody that is going to go around telling people you’ve got to born again can’t believe the way he does. I don’t know.
Dr. Reagan: So, the point here is that the people who are going out in the Rapture are going to be those people who have truly been born again who have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. Not just sincere people. Not just people who have been born into a Christian family. Not just people who have their name on a church roll. In fact I think there is going to be a lot of people in churches the day after the Rapture, or a few days after the Rapture. Now this leads to another question: What about Old Testament Saints? How about those who died in a faith relationship with God before the cross of Jesus Christ? Will those people be going out in the Rapture?
Gary Fisher: No, Daniel 12:1, Daniel indicates that his people would go clear through the end of the seven year Tribulation, and they would be resurrected at the end of that time. So, the Rapture refers to only the Saints in the Church.
Dr. Reagan: Yes, it is a promise to the Bride of Christ. He is the Bridegroom, the Church is His Bride. And this comes I might say as a great shock to a lot of people. Even to people who know the Bible well they just never really thought about that. That Old Testament Saints are not part of the Bride of Christ. And I think you’re right it clearly indicates in Daniel 12 that the Old Testament Saints will be resurrected at the end of the Tribulation, along with Tribulation Martyrs, who will also will be resurrected at that particular time, correct?
Gary Fisher: Yes. Amen.
Dr. Reagan: Now, if a person is watching and is not sure whether or not he or she will be taken out in the Rapture. Let’s say the Rapture occurred today because the Rapture could occur any time. Now, let’s assume that somebody is watching right now who is not really certain whether they would be taken out or not. What would you say to that person?
Dennis Pollock: Well, what they need to do Dave, is they need to experience Jesus Christ. It’s kind of like the people that you say, “Well, are you sure you would go to Heaven if you died?” There are many people that say “I’m a Christian. I go to church.” But if you really pin them down, they’d say, “Well, I’m not certain I’d go to Heaven.” And they are the same way with the Rapture. And basically it amounts to one thing, and that is putting your entire faith upon the person and the work of Jesus Christ. Not, depending on a Church. Not depending on good works, but upon Jesus Christ Himself. Having done that then it amounts to taking God at His word.
Dr. Reagan: Yes.
Dennis Pollock: Some people the problem is they are ready to commit themselves to Christ but they’re thinking, well if I do would He really accept me? Would I really be ok? What if the Rapture came on a bad day and I wasn’t doing so well? And that gets down to the issue of justification. The fact that when you truly put the weight of your faith on Jesus Christ you will be justified even if you just had a bit of an argument with your wife over how lousy she cooked dinner, you’re still going to go in the Rapture if you truly belong to Jesus Christ.
Dr. Reagan: You know, you are describing me because I went to church for 30 years in a very legalistic church. And the last thing in the world I wanted to see even though I went to church every time the door was open was to see Jesus Christ come. Because I figured He was up there watching me behind the cloud, and he was going to wait until I committed the worst sin of my life and come at that moment, because I believed I had to earn my salvation. I had to work my way to heaven. And I did not know anything about the grace of God. I will never forget when I discovered Romans 8:1 which says, “There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.” And boy I started jumping the pews, and hanging from the chandeliers because I realized I’m saved by grace and not by my works.
Dennis Pollock: Yeah, the sad thing is a lot of preachers add to this whole issue by using it as a club to try to get people to hold the line, which it should be a motivation. But when you get to the point where you say you are going to lose your salvation if you do the least little thing wrong and He comes at that point you are missing really the point of justification by faith.
Dr. Reagan: Right. Right. Well gentlemen let me ask you this: What is likely to be the impact of the Rapture upon the world, and upon the United States in particular?
Gary Fisher: Chaos.
Dr. Reagan: Chaos.
Gary Fisher: The United States of America is a country that boasts of probably more born-again Christians than any nation in the world. And at the Rapture those people are removed from the earth. If that would occur today more than likely it would pull the President and maybe the Vice President and others in dignitary positions. And maybe half of the population of the United States. It would render the United States impotent in the world scene.
Dennis Pollock: The word that comes to my mind is dysfunctional. We would have a dysfunctional nation. Of course we wouldn’t we’ll be gone, but there would be a dysfunctional nation. Another thought a lot of people don’t realize is you’re going to have entire households that are gone. You are going to have empty houses. You are going to have businesses, small businesses at least that may have no one there. There is going to be an incredible amount of looting going on. Crime. You know people will take advantage of those situations. People very insecure. It will absolutely be the worst day for those left behind that our nation has ever seen.
Dr. Reagan: Chaos. Dysfunctional. Break down of society, particularly in a country like the United States because as you said Gary we probably have more born again Christians in America right now than all of Western Europe and England put together. And the United States would just be absolutely devastated by it. In fact that maybe one of the reasons that we are not mentioned in end time Bible prophecy.
Gary Fisher: Another thing about this issue is that 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 says there is a Great Restrainer in the world today.
Dr. Reagan: Yes.
Gary Fisher: And many Bible prophecy teachers believe that that Restrainer is working inside the Church. If the Church is removed, restraining evil on the world. The next thing the scripture says is the Antichrist will be revealed. So there is chaos. And then if that’s not enough here comes this Antichrist guy who is going to terrorize the world. So, terror and chaos are going to be on the earth.
Dr. Reagan: Well, I can just see him stepping into that situation and saying, “Hey, I’ve got the answers to all the problems. There is no reason for this lawlessness, this chaos, whatever. I’ve got the answer.” And in fact a lot of people are going to have answers, not only the Antichrist but others. There is going to be a lot of explanations of the Rapture. Now, stop and think about that for a moment. People just disappear out of cars, out of airplanes. You are sitting and talking to somebody they disappear. What kind of explanations could people give for that other than the biblical one that they’ve been taking out by the Lord?
Gary Fisher: I have labored over this issue as a Bible prophecy student. I am working very hard to try to come up with a reason that the world will believe. But there will be many explanations I’m sure.
Dr. Reagan: And remember the Bible says the end times will be a time of deception so there will be explanations, and people will be deceived into accepting those explanations instead of what really happened.
Gary Fisher: Exactly.
Dennis Pollock: You know Paul talks about those that suppress the truth in unrighteousness; to suppress or to hold down the truth. The obvious explanation is the Bible was true after all. God took His people exactly as He said He would.
Dr. Reagan: But that is too obvious. Too simple.
Dennis Pollock: And there is going to be a lot of people that do not want to believe that. They do not want to believe they’ve been left behind. The fanatics were right after all; you know the fundamentalists and so forth.
Dr. Reagan: Well, I tell you what I can just imagine three days after the Rapture as people are kind of getting over the initial shock and beginning to try to put two and two together. I can just imagine an interview on the streets of Dallas, with you know just the man of the street going something like this:
National Radio Correspondent: Excuse me, ma’am I’m a national radio correspondent seeking the opinions of people regarding the great disappearance. Would you mind me telling me your idea of what happened?
Woman: Oh, I don’t know. I just don’t know. It is all just so bewildering. But I’m just praising God that none of my family is missing. But some of my neighbors are. I tell you my husband has an opinion on everything, why don’t you ask him?
National Radio Correspondent: Ok, so what do you think, sir?
First Man: Well, I think it is a result of some government experiment that went haywire. Do you remember back in the 40’s and 50’s when the Feds injected people with radioactive solutions? Some people went crazy, and some even died. I think it’s something like that.
Woman: Our son says that spaceships that zapped them up into space.
First Man: Yeah, you remember like on Star Trek how they used to beam me up Scotty? I still think it’s the Feds that are involved in it.
Second Man: Well, excuse me but I think your son is right on target, mister.
Woman: What’s that?
Second Man: I said, your son is right on target.
National Radio Correspondent: What do you mean by that?
Second Man: I mean anybody that’s got two bits worth of sense knows that it is aliens.
National Radio Correspondent: Aliens?
Second Man: Yeah, space aliens. All those Feds and people in Washington have been laughing at all the UFO sightings all this time. I’m telling you the chickens have come home to roost. They are here and they are bound and determined to take over our planet.
Dr. Reagan: Well, you know I have no difficulty believing that people will come up with theories like government conspiracies and space aliens. But do you think anybody would really believe those things?
Dennis Pollock: Dave, they are going to grasping at straws. You know the thought that came to my mind as I was watching that clip was, can you imagine what is going to be flashing back and forth on the internet as people are going to be constantly coming up with this idea, and that idea.
Dr. Reagan: The conspiracy theorists will run amuck.
Dennis Pollock: Oh, they will be going crazy.
Dr. Reagan: Absolutely going crazy! I tell you I think there is going to be a better explanation out there that a lot of people will buy. And that is the explanation that has been given for a long time, ever since the early 70’s by the New Age Movement. You are familiar with the New Age Movement.
Dennis Pollock: I sure am.
Dr. Reagan: Tell us briefly what is their explanation of what’s going to happen?
Dennis Pollock: Well, the New Age Movement has believed that the people that are traditional, fundamental Christians are holding back the evolution of the planet. And they think that at some point, or at least some of them have been saying that they are going to be taken out of the way so that the true believers can go forward in a quantum leap in evolutional progress.
Dr. Reagan: Well, along that line I can just imagine the head of the New Age Movement being the strange person he would have to be, holding a press conference and saying to the nation something like this:
New Age Spokesperson (Dennis Pollock): Let’s see if I can make this as simple as possible. Now, we’ve been teaching for many years that the evolutionary progress of humankind has reached its limit because of the resistance of those who are determined to live by faith, or tradition rather than yielding themselves to the supremacy of human reason. For over 30 years we have had teachers saying that the spirit guide they’re in touch with, we call these entities the Masters of the Universe. But these spirit guides have been saying that they would soon remove from the earth all those who insist on living by faith, or tradition. These fanatical fundamentalists if you will, they would remove them from the earth and that would enable the evolutionary progress of mankind to continue towards its goal of ultimate perfection. At which point we would become one with the universe, and experience the full potential of the god power that’s within us all. Now, that is why we don’t like to call this event the Great Disappearance as so many are calling it. No, we rather consider it the Great Cleansing. You see as we see it what has happened is the earth has been cleansed of those, shall we say undesirable elements so that those of us who are superior can continue on at a much more rapid rate toward perfection under the guidance of our spirit masters.
Dr. Reagan: Well, I tell you fellas. Now, Gary now let me ask you something: Did that guy look suspicious to you? I mean is it somebody you might know?
Gary Fisher: He was an extremely cool dude. He looked very familiar.
Dr. Reagan: I don’t know Dennis, he was kind of echoing what you had said.
Dennis Pollock: Well, I tell you I was just wondering how they got Tom Cruise to come and participate in that particular episode. I don’t know.
Dr. Reagan: Well, I tell you what he had to say I’m afraid many people are really going to buy to get serious about this, because I think they are. I think that it just sounds so reasonable that this would be what happened. Instead of thinking in supernatural terms instead of God, you think in supernatural terms of masters of the universe, and the demonic. But you know the other explanation that I can imagine would be the one that religious leaders would try to give. Think of Christian leaders, major Christian leaders who have not been taken in the Rapture and who are trying to come up with some explanation of what happened. I can imagine for example the head of the World Council of Churches being interviewed at the United Nations and saying to the world something like this:
Mr. Morgan: Welcome to our program, Reverend Watson.
Reverend Watson: Thank you, Mr. Morgan it is good to be with you. I appreciate this opportunity to help in trying to stem the widespread hysteria that has gripped the world.
Mr. Morgan: Reverend Watson, as a world renowned Christian leader as yourself, how could you speak to the rumor that what has happened is a rapture of the church as spoken in the Christian scriptures?
Reverend Watson: I would be delighted to deal with that idea. It is of course totally absurd. And I can prove that very easily.
Mr. Morgan: How would you do that?
Reverend Watson: Well, the mere fact that you are sitting here talking to me. I am after all one of the foremost Christian leaders in the world today. If the church has been raptured, then why am I still here?
Mr. Morgan: That’s a good point. Tell me what is the meaning of all this talk about the Rapture? What is the meaning and the concept of Christian theology?
Reverend Watson: You will not find it in Christian theology. No theologian worth mentioning has ever endorsed the idea. It has long been the fantasy of a small group of so called evangelical Christians who have taken one obscure passage from the writings of Paul and interpreted it literally to mean that one day the Church would be supernaturally taken out of the world. The whole idea is absurd. Paul was simply speaking of the raptures delight which the soul experiences when a person discovers God. That can happen to anyone: Buddhist, Jew, Muslim, Christian, or Hindu. After all God has revealed Himself in many ways.
Mr. Morgan: How would you respond to the contention of the leaders of the New Age Movement that what we have experienced is a cleaning of the earth by what is called the Masters of the Universe?
Reverend Watson: Well, of course we have great respect for the New Age leaders. We even voted recently to incorporate their new mother earth church into the World Council of Churches. But on this point I think they are way off base. No one in the leadership of the World Council can accept the idea of supernatural spirits of any kind directing the affairs of humankind. Like our brothers and sisters in the New Age Movement we endorse the supremacy of human reason, but unlike them we endorse it with no exceptions. And that certainly excludes the idea of any supernatural force that is guiding the affairs of this planet in any way.
Mr. Morgan: What then is your explanation of this Great Disappearance?
Reverend Watson: Well, the World Council has not issued any official explanation. We are still waiting for all of the data to be assembled. We have full confidence in the scientific community, and we believe that when all the data is compiled a very rational, and sensible explanation will emerge. We have great faith in science.
Mr. Morgan: Thank you, Reverend Watson.
Dr. Reagan: Well, that is rather sad. Do you really imagine that could be a believable scenario?
Dennis Pollock: Well, sadly, Dave it is very easy to imagine that. From what we know about liberal Christianity, the World Council of Churches they are going to be saying something just like that after the Rapture occurs.
Dr. Reagan: How about you, Gary?
Gary Fisher: Well, what is alarming is that there are teachers out there saying it now. So, it is very easy to believe they’d be saying it after the Rapture.
Dr. Reagan: You hit the nail on the head. Let me just kind of shift gears for a moment and ask you another question and that is: Do you think that the Rapture itself could result in many people being saved? In response let’s say to the event. Will some people come to know the Lord?
Dennis Pollock: Well, there is no doubt about it I think there is going to be one of the greatest turnings to Christ the world has ever seen after the Rapture. There are going to be a lot of people despite all the explanations that are going to know deep in their heart this is God. This is what grandma talked about. This is what Christians have preached about. And even those that don’t know the theology of the Rapture are going to say, “Hey, this has to be the hand of God.” And it is amazing what traumatic events do. They tend to push people either away from God or toward God. And there is a lot that will be hardened, but they’ll be a number that will come to Jesus Christ. And I think it will be a time–you know you read in Revelation–a lot of people say, will there be Christians in the Tribulation? Revelation describes the Tribulation. Absolutely. There will be Christians there but they won’t be this current batch, it will be a new batch that will come after the Rapture.
Dr. Reagan: Yes, people who are saved after the Rapture, right? You agree?
Gary Fisher: Oh, I agree fully. I don’t think today that we understand the impact of what will actually occur at the Rapture. Millions of people just gone. And it is going to be one of the most alarming incidences that has ever occurred on the earth.
Dennis Pollock: This ministry has produced a tape called, “The Great Disappearance.” And this has been one of the most successful tapes we have ever produced. It begins with a simulation by professional actors of what it is going to be like three days after the Rapture. And then it moves into about a 45 minute teaching that I give about what is the Rapture? When is it most likely to happen? All of it based on the Bible. And then it concludes with a testimony by one of our trustees of this ministry who has gone on to be with the Lord incidentally since this tape was made. He was a man who was a tough living guy who didn’t know anything about God until he was 55 years old. Accepted Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior, completely transformed his life and he tells about this on this tape, and tells people what they must do in order to become a Christian. Well, we only have a minute and a half left. So, let me just very quickly ask you this: Some people argue that only those can be saved after the Rapture who have never heard the Gospel beforehand. What do you think about that? Will those be the only ones who can be saved or not?
Dennis Pollock: Well, Dave, you are asking us to deal with a very complicated theological issue in a minute and a half. And I don’t know if we can do that. But, you are right that is a theory that is based on a passage in 2 Thessalonians that talks about the world rejecting God, not receiving the love of the truth and therefore God will send them a strong delusion. Do you apply that specifically meaning if you have ever heard the Gospel? I’m not convinced of that. But it is certainly something to think about.
Dr. Reagan: Gary, do you have anything to say about it?
Gary Fisher: Well, the scripture verse 2 Thessalonians 2:11, “For this reason God will send upon them deluding influence so they might believe what is false, in order they may all be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness.” The implication of this are very strong.
Dr. Reagan: And the setting is the appearance of the Antichrist. So, there is a biblical basis for that position, although, the particular scripture there is not crystal clear. I guess my position on it is that I certainly wouldn’t want to assure anyone absolutely that if they’ve heard the Gospel now and then the Rapture occurs that they will be able to respond afterwards. I hope that will be the case, and it could very well be. But the important thing is to respond to the Gospel now while there is still an opportunity.
Dennis Pollock: That’s for sure.
Dr. Reagan: Because the Rapture as we pointed out in our last program can occur any moment, and we are living on borrowed time.
Gary Fisher: Amen.
Dr. Reagan: As we bring our program to a close today I want to emphasize to you that the Rapture is an event that could occur any moment. Whereas there are many prophecies that must be fulfilled before Jesus returns to this earth. There is not one prophecy that has to be fulfilled before the Rapture occurs. Again the Rapture is an event that could happen any moment. If it were to occur today would you be ready? Would Jesus appear as your Blessed Hope or as your Holy Terror? Next week, the Lord willing, we are going to begin a series of programs about the signs of the times that point to the soon return of Jesus. Until then look up, be watchful, for our redemption is drawing near.
End of Program