Which is the best explanation of the world around us – Special Creation or Evolution? Find out with Mike Riddle on the show Christ in Prophecy.
Last aired on June 9, 2013.
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Dr. Reagan: Did the earth come into existence through a “big bang” followed by millions of years of evolution? Or was it created by God about 6,000 years ago in six days? Which is the best explanation of the world we see around us- special creation or evolution? And, does it really make any difference? Stay tuned.
Dr. Reagan: Greetings in the name of Jesus, our blessed Hope, and welcome to Christ in Prophecy. My colleague Nathan Jones and I have a very special guest with us today who I know is going to be a very special blessing to all of you. His name is Mike Riddle and he is the founder and director of a wonderful ministry called The Creation Training Initiative. Mike welcome to Christ in Prophecy.
Mike Riddle: Thank you, David it is a privilege to be here.
Dr. Reagan: Well we are delighted to have you. And folks something that I need to explain to you, as I was going to introduce Mike as an ex-Marine. But he told me if I did so he would make me do 20 push-ups on camera. He explained that, “Once a Marine always a Marine, no such thing as an ex-Marine.” Right?”
Mike Riddle: Thank you, David.
Dr. Reagan: Ok. Well Mike your ministry has a rather unusual name, The Creation Training Initiative, explain that for us.
Mike Riddle: Well David there’s other ministries out there that do creation great ministries like the Institute for Creation Research, Answers in Genesis, there are a lot of local organizations around the country. But what we’ve done is started this ministry to take the next step and that is actually train others to do what we are doing. It is called replicating ourselves, biblical discipleship. We do the seminars, we do the weekend seminars but what we do is training courses, we have full-day training courses that we implement.
And why we’re doing this is we’re tired of seeing over 70% of our youth, our teens, leaving the church before they finish school. That’s an epidemic we have in this country in Christianity. These are students who have been in Christian schools, even in Sunday school for 12 years. Why is that happening? They don’t have confidence in the Bible anymore. They don’t see answers in the Bible.
So, we started these courses and they are full day training courses. You come take a course such as Basic Creation Training. And what you do is you get a 100 page manual. We feed you lunch, and we feed you snacks and they are certified for continuing education units. And the thing is we will come to you, it doesn’t cost the church anything to have these. We charge per individual. So we are trying to get this information out.
We even have a course specific for teachers where we train you what does the Bible have to say about teachers and how to teach? We even have a 3rd course called Advance Creation Apologetics where we train you to take the next step in evangelism. How to talk to a Ph.D. scientist and not have to know anything about the science and bring down the strong-holds.
Dr. Reagan: Well I compliment you on that it’s very important. And something that we’ve always had a heart for in this ministry to replicate. And we’ve done it primarily by helping others establish ministries that focus on Bible prophecy. We’ve done 5 of those so far and then helped train them to communicate the message. So God bless you in what you are trying to do.
Mike Riddle: Thank you.
Dr. Reagan: Nathan, how about kicking off with the first question here?
Nathan Jones: Alright, well great to have you here Mike.
Mike Riddle: Thank you, Nathan.
Nathan Jones: Alright, one question we get a lot and I even read it today on our YouTube Channel people are always bashing Christians for a belief that well science has proven that the earth is millions, and millions of years old, so why don’t we just get off this young earth thing and just accept science for how it is? How do you respond to people like that?
Mike Riddle: That is a very big one out there. People do believe, not only non-believers unfortunately there are many Christians out there, believers who think the scientist have proven the earth is billions of years old.
Well that comes from a misinterpretation or misunderstanding of the limits of science. Scientist cannot prove the age of the earth. In other words we divide science in two main areas, one is called observational science or operational science. That’s how we build our jet engines, how we do our medical technology, how we do computers. Those are things that we can observe, we can touch and feel.
But then there is another area of science called origins science, or historical science those are the things that happened in the past. We were not there to observe them happening. Therefore we have to piece the clues together. In other words it’s based on assumptions or our interpretation of the evidence. And that’s what people do not understand. The scientist cannot prove the age of the earth.
Incidentally what they’re not looking at there is an overwhelming amount of scientific evidence that shows the earth is very young. But the real issue for believers is they are not starting with the Bible. You see when I read the Bible it starts off with God created everything in six days. And He uses the word day there. And what God did to make sure we understand they were literal days He put a number with each day, first day, second day, third day, fourth day.
I like to ask people: “How many times did God use a number with the word day in the Old Testament?” And it is 410 times. And not one of those occasions does it mean a long period of time. But God even made it easier for us He defined His days, evening and morning first day. Evening and morning second day. Everywhere in the Old Testament we see the phrase evening and morning it only means a day. But God didn’t stop there, what a wonderful God we have.
Dr. Reagan: Amen.
Mike Riddle: When He wrote down the Ten Commandments, commandment number four He wrote this down, “For in six days the Lord made the heaven, the earth, the sea and all that it is in them therefore…” I like that word therefore, if we don’t accept God’s days of creation as being literal days then commandment number four doesn’t mean what it really says and it is open to our interpretation. And if commandment number four is open to our interpretation how can we trust the other nine?
Nathan Jones: Four being the Sabbath.
Mike Riddle: Right, by giving up our foundation in Genesis we have now given up a literal interpretation of the Ten Commandments. This is a serious issue.
Dr. Reagan: There was One observer of the creation.
Mike Riddle: Yes.
Dr. Reagan: And He has told us how He did it.
Mike Riddle: Exactly.
Dr. Reagan: But there are no scientist who observed that.
Mike Riddle: No, exactly.
Dr. Reagan: So they really haven’t proved.
Mike Riddle: No they can’t prove the age of the earth. What they do is they find evidence and we all look at the same evidence then we interpret what we see. And we interpret based on our worldview, our starting point. And as for me I start with God’s Word as my authority.
Dr. Reagan: Wow. Well tell us a little about your background. What sort of background do you have that gives you some authority in this area?
Mike Riddle: Well one of the things that helps, me unfortunately I was a slow learner, I grew up an Evolutionist.
Nathan Jones: Oh, yeah.
Mike Riddle: I was not even a Christian until I was 30 years old. So I understand the evolution and their arguments very well. I could use them in churches and it was very easy to take a church off track because they were not well trained in this. So I’ve got the back ground in evolution. And I’ve got background in some of the scientist I have degrees in mathematics, and education. But you know my most important aspect I have as my credentials? I’m a Bible believing Christian, I accept God’s Word as my authority. That’s my number one credential. I have the math. I have degrees in education. I’ve got a vast experience in computer technology. That is where I get all my logical thinking from, the math and computer science. But that is part of my background there.
Dr. Reagan: How did you get started in this?
Mike Riddle: Well having grown up an Evolutionist. I was also, well I’ll put it this way I used to be an athlete. If everyone understands what that means, I used to be an athlete. It’s called there is this law of science called Thermo Dynamics that tends to take you downhill a little bit.
Nathan Jones: Entropy.
Mike Riddle: Yes, so that happens to all of us.
Dr. Reagan: I realize that when I look in the mirror every morning.
Mike Riddle: But one day I was in the gymnasium lifting weights and I had a man come up and sit down beside me. And this man started giving me the Gospel. And he asked me some questions. But you know at that time I had no interest in God. So I ignored everything he had to tell me. But seven years after that I was in a hotel room on a trip, a business trip in computers at the time. I finally understood that man’s message and that’s the night in that hotel room I got on my knees and professed Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. But you know before I went to sleep that night I had a strong desire to teach the book of Genesis which I hadn’t even read yet.
Dr. Reagan: I mean immediately.
Mike Riddle: Yes. I couldn’t believe. So I reached into the drawer in that hotel room and pulled out the Bible and began reading the book of Genesis. And I thought to myself, “Wait a minute this is not what I was taught in university. If I cannot trust the first chapter in this Bible there is no reason to read the rest of it.” So, or some of what I was taught in university was not true. I had the opportunity to travel all over the country and I’d stop and talk to these professor and scientists. I soon found a pattern to their answers about evolution. They had a lot of wonderful stories, but not one of them could directly answer my questions. So I thought, “Here are these people who are very intelligent, very intelligent couldn’t answer my basic questions. So why should I believe in evolution?” Because when I turned to the Bible I found the answers.
Dr. Reagan: Welcome back to Christ in Prophecy and our discussion of Creationism with our special guest Mike Riddle.
Nathan Jones: Mike I’ve got a question for you. I want to know what does it matter, I mean why should a Christian care whether they believe in evolution or the young earth? I mean how is that even practical to our daily life?
Mike Riddle: Well that’s a great question because we don’t get into a lot of churches to teach this message because they don’t see it as a real issue.
Nathan Jones: Yeah.
Mike Riddle: Let me give you four points on this. Why it really does make a different.
Point number one is the authority of God’s Word. When do we believe it? When do we not believe it? In other words if we don’t believe God is the creator of all things then we can believe in evolution. And that is where a lot of people are, they try to combine the two. But point number two is Genesis is foundational to almost every single one of our Christian doctrines. In other words Genesis give us the definition of marriage; that is between one man and one woman. If we don’t believe Genesis is real history what is our definition of marriage? Well we have to go with what the world says.
Genesis gives us a definition about human life. The sanctity of human life. In other words if you want to believe in abortion you can just throw away Genesis. But if you want to believe in the sanctity of human life that we were made in the image and likeness of God and that we are fearfully and wonderfully made, that comes right from there. In other words that tells us that we are not animals. In other words in a biology classroom we are taught that humans are nothing more than an animal with higher intelligence. But if we accept the book of Genesis we are fearfully and wonderfully made, made in His image and likeness and we’re not animals we’re special. So there’s the first two points.
Third point is a very important one without Genesis we don’t have a Gospel. You see there are really four parts of the Gospel. The central part of the Gospel is Jesus Christ; that is the main part of the Gospel. That Jesus Christ, God, came down to this planet He let His Son fully man suffer and died on that cross and was raised from the dead. But I have a question: Why did He have to shed His blood? We have to go back to the book of Genesis to get the rest of the story. And the story starts with God’s creation in six days and in Genesis 1:31 He called it very good, perfect, no blemish, perfect. So that’s the first part of the Gospel is God and His creation. Second part is man, we’re the problem. We’re the ones that rebelled against His perfect Creation. We’re the ones that fell into sin, and we became separated from God. So the first part is God. Second part is man, we’re the problem. The third part is Jesus Christ which is God’s solution to our problem. Then there is the fourth part, a very important one our response it is not what we can do, for it is by grace we have been saved through faith. It is not what we can do, it is what God has already done for us. And he did it on the cross. Those are the four parts of the Gospel. And the first two are in the book of Genesis.
Dr. Reagan: And that first point you made is one that I’d like to emphasize over and over and over again. The validity of God’s Word is at stake here. If we can’t believe the beginning why should we believe the ending? Why should we believe in the resurrection? Why should we believe in any part of it? W.A. Criswell the former renowned pastor of First Baptist Church said, “So many people today have a leopard method of interpretation of the Bible.” And I said, “What does that mean?” And he said, “Well, they claim the Bible is inspired only in spots, and they know those spots.”
Mike Riddle: Yes.
Dr. Reagan: And the spots they agree with.
Mike Riddle: Exactly right. But you know there is a fourth one here. I want to get this fourth one.
Dr. Reagan: Ok, yeah.
Mike Riddle: And that is the relationship of sin and death. If we’re believing in evolution and what evolution stands on is this idea of billions of years. If this earth is billions of years old what was going on for those billions of years before Adam and Eve? And the answer would be death, decay, and disease. All that would have been happening before sin. So a belief in evolution and billions of years is a belief in death before sin. Now why did Jesus have to go to the cross and physical concur death? That’s an important issue that effects the Gospel.
Dr. Reagan: It certainly is.
Nathan Jones: Very practical. Very practical.
Dr. Reagan: Well let me ask you this. Scientist say the universe began with a big bang, an explosion, what are the problems with that theory?
Mike Riddle: Well the first problem is no where do we see that in the Bible. And the next thing we have to understand what is the big bang? And why was it invented? Well the Big Bang was originally invented to explain everything in this universe without a Creator, that’s the first big problem.
The second problem is it doesn’t agree with science. And this is where a lot of people are going astray. It does not agree with science. There are many scientific evidences that refute the Big Bang. Now one of the things I like to do in one of our courses and I do it in one of my regular talks is talk about this is what they are teaching in school. And this is what they are not teaching in school. In other words what we find in our public education system is they are teaching evolution and not real science anymore. For example let’s talk about the Big Bang. There is a starting question we begin with. Where did the matter come from to create the big bang?
Dr. Reagan: I was going to say, what exploded?
Mike Riddle: Yes, because you can’t have something go bang until you have something that can go bang. That is just common sense and logic.
A second question is what caused it to explode? Those questions are not allowed to be asked in a lot of our universities classrooms. But then we have the other problems. Did you know the Big Bang does not explain the origin of the stars? Stars do not form by naturalistic processes, no one has ever observed a star come from anywhere. So where did they all come from? Well we get this idea from our textbooks, we get these great big gas of dust clouds called nebula that is the fancy term. We’ll just call them gas of dust. And they rotate around and around and around. As they rotate around and around we are told the gravitation collapses inward and after a period of time they have formed a star.
Nathan Jones: A dust cloud forming a star.
Mike Riddle: But I give a technical term to that that is called bologna. Folks we know–
Dr. Reagan: I didn’t know that was a technical term.
Nathan Jones: Yeah, wow.
Mike Riddle: Yes it is that is a very technical term.
Nathan Jones: I’m going to use that one.
Mike Riddle: See we know and we can do this in experiments in the classroom that as the gas cloud does rotate around it will begin gravitation and collapse inward. But you know what happens as it collapses inward? It generates heat pressure and we can measure this. That heat pressure is always stronger in the gravity and always causes the cloud to expand outward.
Dr. Reagan: Oh.
Nathan Jones: Oh.
Mike Riddle: So we have no scientific proof how stars form. It’s all conjecture based on Evolutionism. So they don’t have that. Then we have things called spiral galaxies. These are galaxies rotating around out there and our Milky Way is a spiral galaxy. But after so many rotations they lose their spiral shape. So if these galaxies are billions of years old, they should not be spiral. So there is a problem with the Big Bang, doesn’t explain that, doesn’t even explain the origin of galaxies.
Nathan Jones: Planets are even spinning around the wrong way too, right?
Mike Riddle: Right we have planets going the wrong way. We have what’s called super nova’s that’s a fancy term for stars that exploded. They used up all their energy and explode. In our galaxy alone this is why they don’t teach this. In our galaxy alone the Milky Way we only find enough exploded stars for an age of about 6,000 years. Isn’t that amazing?
Dr. Reagan: What a coincidence.
Nathan Jones: Yeah, what a coincidence.
Mike Riddle: The fact that we have comets shows our solar system has to be very young. The Big Bang doesn’t prove that.
Nathan Jones: Well you brought up stars and you are talking about that and it has to be young but wouldn’t it take, because of a light year millions of years for light from some of these stars to reach earth?
Dr. Reagan: Well I want to hold off on that, I want to hold off on that. That’s another question. I want to stay with the Big Bang for a moment. Not only do we have a problem, all the problems that you mentioned but how many explosions have you ever seen that created order?
Mike Riddle: None, they don’t do that. Having been in the Marines I know that for sure. But the Big Bang what they teach is somehow the matter got here. How got here we are not allowed to ask. And that matter somehow started to expand in a hot fire ball. And what it is an expansion of space and time and has no center, no special place. That is part of the proponents of Big Bang right there.
Dr. Reagan: Ok, Nathan, stars.
Nathan Jones: Light takes a long time to travel, 6,000 years not enough. How do you explain that?
Mike Riddle: Right when we look at that on the surface level that looks like it would be a problem for Christians. Now here is the situation. The Bible teaches the earth is about 6,000 years old created in six literal days. So if these galaxies out there are millions of light years away, how in the world could that light reach us in only about 6,000 years? Well we do have possible scientific explanations. We do have some scientific explanations, they could be right, they could be wrong, we don’t know. But we do forget that we have a God that can do anything. We tend to limit Him too much. He could get that light here. He could have used any scientific terms. He could have used some miracles. But our God we forget is all powerful and all knowing. First of all He created everything out of nothing.
Dr. Reagan: That’s right.
Mike Riddle: So He can get that light here. But we do have some possible scientific explanations.
Nathan Jones: Yeah, what are those because people don’t generally take the, “Well God can just supernaturally do it out there?”
Mike Riddle: Yes, well without getting into all the details they can get this on-line from Answers in Genesis website or the Institute for Creation website. There is one called Time Dilation, how gravity affects time. The greater the gravitational pull, the slower time will go. And we can measure that using our atomic clocks so we know that happens. So if we have a greater gravitational effect here on earth time could be going slower than it is out there. Those stars could have aged hundreds of thousands and millions of years in just 6,000 earth years. Now I’m careful when I talk about that because we can get glazed eyes talking about that kind of stuff.
Dr. Reagan: Oh, yeah.
Nathan Jones: I find it fascinating.
Mike Riddle: And there are other possible explanations but what I like to point out is and here we go to this is what they teach, and this is what they don’t teach. The Evolutionist have a bigger problem than we do with the distant starlight. First of all they have to get their light source, stars. Where did those stars come from? They just make up rescue mechanisms here.
But here is another problem they have it is called the temperature of the universe. When we look out all around this universe it seems to be what we call a homogenous or consistent temperature. There has not been enough time in the alleged 13 billion years for the light energy from this side of the universe to have traveled over and interact with this side of the universe. In order to get a homogenies temperature all the light energy has to have interacted. But there has not been enough time, so why is the temperature the same? Now here is what the evolutionists do, they have answers, explanations for these things. But I’ll point out every one of their explanations is not based on observable science. It is what we call a rescue mechanism to rescue their philosophy. So the distant starlight we both, both believer and the non-believer ultimately have to accept by faith. Then we have to go to what is your faith in evolution have to offer me? And I’ll tell you what my faith in Jesus Christ has to offer you.
Dr. Reagan: Welcome back to Christ in Prophecy and our interview with Mike Riddle regarding the creation story in Genesis 1.
Nathan Jones: Mike I’ve got a question for you. We have Dr. David R. Reagan and there is a Dr. David F. Reagan out there who believes in the Gap Theory and people are always getting Dr. David R. Reagan mixed up. But can you explain the Gap Theory for people so they know that we don’t believe in the Gap Theory. What is it and what are the verses it applies to?
Dr. Reagan: And I want to say that again, I do not believe in the Gap Theory. I’ve never believed in the Gap Theory and tell us about the Gap Theory.
Mike Riddle: Well first of all let’s explain what the Gap Theory is.
Dr. Reagan: Ok.
Mike Riddle: And why it got invented. In the 1800’s people started believing that the earth was old and that was part of what Charles Darwin brought about. The earth has to be old to accommodate the whole idea and philosophy of Evolutionism. Well a lot of our theologians started to cave in at this point said, “Well if they’ve proven the earth to be billions of years old where are we going to put this time?”
Well they decided to invent something called a gap. So what they did and to explain the long geologic ages in the fossil record they put a gap between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 well that reads like this, “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth and the earth was without form and void.” So what they do in between those two verses they put this gap of time of millions of years to accommodate the geologic time. And they reword it a little bit. They say, “In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth, not was, but became without form and void.” In other words giving the indication that God created it, something happened sometimes there a lot of different versions of this to be Satan’s fall–
Dr. Reagan: Like Satan coming down.
Mike Riddle: –Satan’s flood destroying everything. So it became without form and void. Now we have to look at this, the word became the verb “hayah” the Hebrew “hayah” there. Can it mean became? Yes it can, but only in very specific cases. Only when it is proceeded by a preposition. In this case it’s not proceeded with a preposition so it is an incorrect translation to translate that verb became rather than was. Now another text they use is in the King James the word replenish in Genesis 1:28 and God told the people to go and replenish, given the indication that something went wrong and people have to refill the earth. Well we have to understand the King James is not wrong there. We have to understand that when the King James Bible was written the word replenished meant to fill, not refill so we have to have a little study in grammar here.
Dr. Reagan: Yes.
Mike Riddle: After the King James Bible was written that verb underwent a definition change. And today it means to refill. So to translate that or make it mean we have to out and refill is an incorrect translation today meant to fill- beginning. But there’s other problems with the Gap Theory, if we put the long geologic ages with the fossil record between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2 the problem here is this; what was going on in that gap there? Death, decay and disease. And again the Gap Theory clearly teaches death before sin.
Dr. Reagan: And the Bible teaches death after sin.
Mike Riddle: Romans 5:12 death came through one man.
Dr. Reagan: How does someone like Hugh Ross handle this question?
Mike Riddle: Hugh Ross’ ministry what they’ll do they’ll try and say that is just referring to human death. And Romans 5:12 does refer to just human death. But he forgets Romans 8:22 where it says, “All of creation groans,” which includes everything including the animals because of one man’s sin. So he misses that point. Or he’ll come up and say, “Well there had to be death before sin. Plants were dying. What were Adam and Eve eating from? Plants. What happens when you dig up plants and eat them? We kill them.” Well he forgets a very important part there. God gives the breath of life to humans and He also breaths the breath of life into animals. But nowhere in the Bible does He give the breath of life to plants. Plants biologically have life because they have a cell structure. But biblically they are not given life. So there really is no death before sin in the Bible anywhere.
Dr. Reagan: And there is no gap between Genesis 1 and 2.
Mike Riddle: No gap. No gap, exactly.
Dr. Reagan: So theologians who can’t accept the young earth have got to come up with another theory.
Mike Riddle: Right and unfortunately again they discredit the authority of God’s Word.
Dr. Reagan: Absolutely.
Mike Riddle: And then there not using good science to do that because the good science does support a very young earth.
Dr. Reagan: Yes, and so does the statement of the Ten Commandments. Where again as you pointed out it says a day is a day.
Mike Riddle: And here’s another one Jesus Christ believed in a young earth. In Mark 10:6 Jesus Christ makes this statement, “But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.” What is Jesus saying there? Man and woman were on this planet from the beginning of the Creation, not after millions of years. There’s Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior and the eyewitness Creator to all things.
Dr. Reagan: Well folks, that’s our program for this week. I hope it’s been a blessing to you, and I hope it has challenged you to think seriously about the origin of our universe. Mike how about telling our viewers how to get in touch with you and your ministry.
Mike Riddle: Well if people want to find out more about our training courses or how to get us to come to their church or location they can go to our website that’s creationtraining.org all one word creationtraining.org.
Dr. Reagan: And can they sign up for a newsletter there?
Mike Riddle: Yes, we have an electronic newsletter were sending out. And next year we are coming out with a hard copy.
Dr. Reagan: Great. And I know that you also have a lot of resources like videos and we’re going to be offering one on this program called, “Apologetics 101.” What are some of the topics?
Mike Riddle: Well some of the topics we are covering in there are like: Where did Cain get his wife? Who did he marry? How can the first three days be real days without the sun? Can we really trust the Bible when we have all this modern science?
Dr. Reagan: And that is only three of about nine topics that you cover. And folks if you write in for that particular video we will send this one free of charge called, “The Beginning and the Ending.” Where I discuss Creationism as well as the ending of the Bible. And so stay tuned for that particular offer at the end of our program. Would you be willing to come back next week and talk about Evolutionism?
Mike Riddle: It would be a pleasure.
Dr. Reagan: Great.
Nathan Jones: Well that’s great Mike. Well folks, we hope you’ll be back with us next week for another session with Mike Riddle concerning this time the issue of Evolution. Until then this is Nathan Jones speaking for myself and Dr. David R. Reagan, “Look up, be watchful, for our redemption is drawing near.”
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