The Israel Decree with Amir Tsarfati

Part 2: Amir Tsarfati Interview

Nathan Jones: Well, Amir, welcome back to Christ in Prophecy.

Amir Tsarfati: Thank you, Tim. Thank you, Nathan. It’s good to be with you.

Tim Moore: Well, Amir, in addition to becoming a gifted speaker, and being one I think naturally, you also are a prolific writer. And your latest book entitled The Israel Decree really caught my attention because it touches on a subject that we’ve been emphasizing for years: God’s covenant promise to the descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, the very namesake of Israel. So, what motivated you to write this book now?

Amir Tsarfati: Well, obviously, this book was like a baby that was born out of the October 7th tragedy. I noticed two things. I noticed there’s an amazing sheer amount of ignorance, and also of deception, when it comes to Israel. Ignorance by people who know nothing but choose to believe the lie, and deception by people who know the truth and yet choose to spread the lie. I realized that there is a need for some sort of a toolbox for people to understand what the Bible says about the land, about the people, and about the promises of God, and not what other people say.

I think that Christians are caught oftentimes in that fire between what the world is saying and the media, and what faith is all about. And I decided that even very veteran people in faith still maybe have a little bit of a doubt whether Israel of today is the very fulfillment of the prophecies that God gave to Israel in the Old Testament.

So, what I did, I decided to just go all the way to the decree given to Abraham in Genesis 12 and to explain it as simple as I can about the fact that we are talking about a promise for a land, a seed, and also a blessing. And these three things, as I explained through the book, have not changed, because we are dealing with a God that cannot change.

Nathan Jones: Amen. Well, Amir, almost two and a half years ago, we witnessed just a horrific outpouring of hate and murder as terrorists, you know, from Hamas infiltrated Israel, and wow, they perpetrated atrocities the scale that it’s just so hard to fathom. How did that impact Israel as a nation, and how does it continue to impact individual Jews in Israel and beyond?

Amir Tsarfati: It’s a good question. You know, first of all, it shocked us all, but to a certain degree, we probably needed that shock. That shock caused the Israelis to understand that they cannot trust their horses or chariots only; they cannot put all their trust in military and intelligence because the time will come when both will fail them.

We also realized that building your entire Zionist idea and ethos on a secular foundation is wrong to begin with, because obviously, our connection to this place is spiritual, is biblical, and the only way to explain and prove and justify our being here is biblical. And if you thought that by behaving nice and being one of all the other nations and by trying to be accepted by the other nations, if you think that that would give you any discount when the time will come and they will try to kill you, then we were all proven wrong.

And Jewish people, predominantly secular, very, very liberal Jews, realized that for our enemies, in their eyes, we’re all settlers, we’re all illegal, and we are all Jews that must be destroyed and annihilated. So I think it shook us, but also it brought us back to the very basic reason why we’re here. And I think we needed that, because for far too long we were trusting our brains, our abilities, our horses, and our chariots, and we kind of left God and His word out of the picture.

Tim Moore: You used a word I’d like to actually have you define, Amir. You used the word Zionist, and I have reminded even some young people I’ve engaged with recently that the word Zionism is actually an old word. Some of the earliest Zionists, I’m talking 150 years ago, were Christian Zionists who read God’s Word, understood its promises, and recognized that God’s promise to the Jewish people, what Ezekiel 36 calls the House of Israel, was to be fulfilled at some point. And so, they began to advocate for Jews to go back to the land. So, what would you say is the definition of Zionism to someone who is not familiar with that word?

Amir Tsarfati: Well, Zionism is basically the right of the Jewish people over their land and the fact that this is their God-given ancestral homeland. And by the way, it’s not based on our feelings or even on circumstances. Circumstances were that we should never leave Europe because it’s a much more horrible place to live in here than over there. And I’m talking about 150 years ago.

Also, we have to remember that at the time, we were not exactly having fun here, but the people realized that this is where we belong. That sense of belonging goes back to even before Ezekiel 36; even in Ezekiel 34 already, He says that He’s going to gather us from the four corners of the earth back to your own land. He said that. And then He reiterated that in Ezekiel 36 and in Ezekiel 37. And when we get to Ezekiel 38, we’re already in our own land, safe, secure, and prosperous.

So, we’re watching amazing fulfillment of Bible prophecy. And that’s why I think that Christian Zionists of 150 years ago could see clearer and could see in a more biblical way things than anyone who only looked through the lens of circumstances. If you lived through the late thirties and early forties, you would think that God forgot about Israel. You would think that it’s the end of the Jewish people.

If circumstances were the only thing you judge reality by, then that’s the conclusion you would reach. But every person who believed in the God-given, I guess, promises knew that it’s not the end. And if you only read the end, all the way to the end of the chapter of Ezekiel 37, he realized that God is going to bring us out of that graveyard of Europe, from the other places around us, and He will bring us back to our own land, known also as the land of Israel. Palestine is not mentioned there, and other people’s ownership over the land is not mentioned there.

So I guess, look, people can say whatever they want. The reality is we’re back in the land, we’re thriving, and this is a great fulfillment of the promises of God. And it testifies of the character of God that He’s a promise keeper.

Tim Moore: Amen.

Nathan Jones: Well, Amir, I went to Colorado Springs, and this was during the summertime, and yet there was a college group out there protesting against Israel. The things that they accused Israel of were absolutely ridiculous. I love how The Israel Decree refutes a lot of what they say. Tell us then, for our audience who might not know why Christians should support Israel, what is the importance of the Abrahamic covenant, and does Israel have a legal precedent in the global community to the land?

Amir Tsarfati: People think that the Bible is about people and not about God. Once you understand that the Bible is about God and His character, and He doesn’t really ask us for our opinion, and we don’t have a vote here, that’s when we try and understand looking at things from His perspective. In God’s mind, Israel was not perfect, is still not perfect, and probably will never be perfect, but He is perfect. His promises are perfect, and every promise of God is yes and amen.

The gifts and the promises of God are irrevocable. You have that in the Old Testament, and you have that in the New Testament because it’s the same God of the Old Testament is the God of the New Testament. So, before Christ came and the Church was born, it was the other nations all around that knew that the God of Israel is out there to look out for His people. Once the Church was born, the Church was urged by the Apostle Paul to also not forget that it’s the same God, and that He did not forget about His people, and that there is a future and a hope.

I always like to bring people back to the eve of Israel’s exile to Babylon. Jeremiah said right then and there, “I know the plans that I have for you, plans to prosper you and not to destroy you, and to give you hope.” These are things that He said a second before He kicks them out of the land, which means even after Israel paid for their lack of faith and disobedience, God continues to be faithful to His promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. And that is the same God that we worship and we serve today.

So, if Christians want to change the narrative and to somehow decide that God changed His mind, and it’s not the same God that we know that cannot be changed, then they have a problem. God does not have the problem. And so, we have to remember that if we teach more about the character of God and the promises of God, we would not fall into that trap of the enemy.

But if we only choose to look at what people say, and what people’s minds are, and what their intentions are, you’ll find out that oftentimes it is not aligned with the Word of God.

Tim Moore: I so appreciate what you say about God being a promise keeper, and I remind Gentile Christians who like to cite the verse you just recited, “I know the plans I have for you,” and they claim it for themselves. The principle applies to anyone who is a follower after Yeshua, who is a Christ follower who hearkens to the family of God. But in the context that that promise was delivered, it was for, again, the house of Israel.

Well, Amir, looking back even over these last two and a half years, one of the galling aspects to me is not only the attack itself, but the shameful duplicity of Western nations and beyond that, even within the Church, people who have systematically turned their back on Israel. Has that lack of true support demotivated the people of Israel, or, as you said earlier, has it inspired them to seek support that is far more faithful than the princes and horses you referred to from Psalm 146?

Amir Tsarfati: Well, first of all, I think that just the fact that we know what was planned originally for October 7th, what was originally planned by the Iranian regime to simultaneously attack us from all sides, and just the fact that Hamas jumped the gun too early, that miracle alone tells the Jewish people, and Israelis in particular, that God was not in the business of destroying us, but actually saving us and protecting us.

Just like, you know, 9/11. If all the intentions of the enemy on 9/11 would’ve been fulfilled, there would’ve been at least a hundred thousand people dead in America. But God somehow rescued people on that day. And yes, we did pay an enormous price, but that price, unfortunately, is a price of negligence, and it is a price of a lot of the fantasy that we had that there is someone to talk to, something to talk about when it comes to peace with people who don’t want peace.

They don’t want to live next to us; they want to live instead of us. And they don’t even think about their future. They think about our destruction. That’s all they care about. I think the Israelis now understand more than ever before that they need to be appreciative to God. I mean, literally, I see a great exodus among Israelis from hedonism, materialism, and secularism towards belief in God.

Now, they may not know their Messiah yet, but in order to believe in the Son of God, you first need to believe that there is a God. And when you understand there is a higher power than just a government, and the military, and intelligence, when you understand that there’s something bigger than all of us, and you understand that you should not try to please anyone that is asking you to leave your heritage and to leave your ancestral rights over the land, then you understand that it’s a much bigger thing than you or your own personal interest.

I think the nation today is more resilient and strong than it has ever been before. And Israel today is a safer and more secure place. We are now stronger than we were, probably the strongest since 1948.

Nathan Jones: Well, Amir, what evidence is there that average Israeli eyes are being opened to the provision and protection that they’re receiving from the Lord God Almighty? I mean, what are the spiritual ramifications that we’re seeing lived out in the people?

Amir Tsarfati: People are now attending more and more prayers and Bible readings. They go into Gaza without forgetting to take their prayer book, and that feeling… They all corporately pray every day together. Look, we haven’t seen that before. We see patches on their uniforms about Messiah, about the Temple, about total victory. These are things that the military tried to be very much outside of all these things. People wanted more than just that. They knew that they’re fighting there because we are here to stay, because there is going to be a Messiah coming. There’s going to be a Temple standing. The land is ours.

It’s no longer we fight just because we are a democracy among democracies, or we want to be part of the families of the world because we are a UN member. We don’t care about the UN anymore. Nobody cares about the UN anymore. In fact, half of the world doesn’t care about the UN anymore. This Board of Peace is because the UN means nothing and does nothing. It’s a bunch of corrupt nations that most of them are not even democracies.

So again, the liberal, progressive mindset is suffering and bleeding in Israel right now. And I think that more and more and more people understand that we will survive because of God. So the sooner you understand that the better it is for you.

Tim Moore: Right now, Amir, as you said, a lot of people either have ignorance or deception. And so, this great deception that is being perpetrated on the world in general, and as I said earlier, even on many portions of the Church, is a satanic lie that God has canceled His promises to Israel or that they are null and void on this side of Jesus’ first advent. So, what would you say to any professing Christian who is tempted to buy into this unbiblical deception?

Amir Tsarfati: I will say, first of all, there is no place in the Bible where the Old Testament is canceled. If the Old Testament was canceled, then Jesus could not have proven Him being the Messiah. And Paul could not have preached even one single sermon anywhere around the world.

Second, the problem is that people don’t understand that the New Testament is, not only that it’s not annulling the Jewish people, but when Paul feels the urgency to go to the Jews first, it means they were actually prioritized in a way. So if God canceled them, why would He send him first to a synagogue to teach?

And the last thing I would say is this: if you attack the promises of God in the Old Testament, you are attacking the same God of the New Testament. If you don’t understand the character of God of the Old Testament, then you surely probably created a new thing in your mind of a different God. But it’s the same God, and it’s the same God that told through Paul that the gifts and the callings of God are irrevocable. A Gentile can never become a Jew. A Jew can never become a Gentile.

There is not a single verse where Israel turned into no Israel, and no Israel turned into Israel. Yes, those who once were not His people are now His people, but they did not become Israel. Being a Jew is a great calling and a great advantage, as Romans says in chapters 9 and 10, but it’s not your ticket to salvation. We’re not saying that; we will never say that. Everybody needs to believe in the Messiah to be saved, but He’s not done with them yet.

And if you decide that 2,000 years ago, God changed His mind and He’s done with them, you are undoing all the things that He promised regarding the future of that nation. And if God is done with Israel, why would Jesus rule from Jerusalem? Why would they celebrate the Feast of Tabernacles? Why would there be a Temple? Why would even the New Jerusalem have 12 gates named after the 12 tribes of Israel? All of these things are telling you that God is not done with Israel.

Even through the Tribulation, there will be 144,000 Jews and two witnesses coming from among them. There is a role for the people of Israel. There is a destiny for the people of Israel, and eventually, all Israel, after the Tribulation, will be saved. So, those promises that I just gave you, they’re from the New Testament. How can we even think for a second that God is done with them when it’s so obvious from Scriptures, such as Romans 11, that He still has a great plan and future for them?

Nathan Jones: You brought up something, really quick, I want to know, what is your pulse, and what is the pulse of the people in Israel about President Trump’s Board of Peace?

Amir Tsarfati: Yeah, it’s interesting because we don’t make a big deal out of it. I know that there’s a lot of conspiracies. People think that that’s the Antichrist, this is the New World Order, all of these things. Eventually, I think that what Trump is trying to do is undo the UN, undo the effect of it, because that organization cannot allow anything good to happen in our region.

Look, think about it. The UN would never vote for Hamas to disarm; the Board of Peace will. The UN would never vote for Israel to stay in 53% of Gaza until Hamas is disarmed and Gaza demilitarized; the Board of Peace did. So, in fact, it’s almost like saying, I don’t care what the UN says, there’s a new guy in town who is more effective, more reasonable, and more realistic. It’s comprised of countries that do matter to this region. And that’s the way we move forward.

I don’t make a big deal out of it. I don’t think Trump is the Antichrist. I don’t think we’re looking at a fake peace. I believe that, if anything, the fake peace will come after the Ezekiel war, and that will also be a peace that also will ride on the amazing victory of God over the enemies of Israel. But for now, what we see now is actually a way for Israel to get stronger and to get more, in a way, you know, successful and prosperous. That will bring us towards the Ezekiel 38 account, and the fact that it’s all about spoils of war and things that they want to take from us.

So again, I am not alarmed by what I see. I don’t think that every time we say peace, it’s immediately the Antichrist. I think that what needs to be a red flag for a Christian when it comes to peace is when somebody offers a temple and a Temple Mount for the Jewish people. That’s when you know that this deal smells like the Antichrist one. Until then, I don’t think, I mean, there’s so many peace deals that were offered and so many attempts to bring peace, and I’m not exactly too, you know, too frantic about this whole thing.

Tim Moore: One of the things that we have been kind of tiptoeing around as we’re taping today in mid-to-late February, is the rising threat once again of Iran. Iran seems to be the nemesis since 1979. It went from being a quasi-ally of Israel, at least a provider of oil and other resources, to now its number one nemesis, fomenting terror all throughout the region. What is the sense in Israel, as we’re speaking today, about the threat from Iran or the potential for reengaged hostilities?

Amir Tsarfati: Well, the sense is that Iran has never been weaker than now. And the sense is that for the first time in the history of the Iranian revolution in the last 49 years, we have unprecedented power that is ready to topple that regime. Personally, because I know Bible prophecy, I am not 100% convinced that they will be toppled. Or maybe this Ayatollah will be gone, but someone evil will replace it because I know that Persia will join Russia in the Ezekiel war.

So, I’m not exactly living in this fantasy land of Iran becoming our best friends in the immediate future. I do think that they will be weak. They will get hammered, because the next time they’ll come against us is when America is not on our side. And even then, they will not do it alone. They will be part of a broader and stronger coalition. So I do believe there’s a good chance we’ll hit them; we’ll hit them hard. But as far as toppling the regime and having a friendly one that will have peace with Israel, that part I’m not that sure about.

Nathan Jones: Well, Amir, our passion here at Lamb & Lion Ministries is to proclaim the soon return of Jesus Christ. What do you believe, what are the signs that indicate that Jesus is coming soon?

Amir Tsarfati: Honestly, everything. Literally every day I wake up knowing that that could be it. I mean, you’ve got the world and every sign that Jesus said about wars and rumors of wars. We’ve got pestilences in the shape of viruses and pandemics. You’ve got famines, we’ve got earthquakes, and volcanoes. And also, you see the fulfillment of that fig tree that came back to life, of Jerusalem back in our hands, but more so, we are stronger than we’ve ever been before, and the Jewish people are moving back to the land.

This antisemitism may be bad, but it’s actually having a good effect on Jews who thought that they can put their trust in governments away from this land, and they think that this is where they belong. Look, at some point every Jew will understand that the safest place for him, and the place where God wants him to be, is this place.

Tim Moore: You know, Amir, I couldn’t have said it better. The Lord is demonstrating everything pointing to Jesus’ soon return. And the fact that Israel is back in the land, back in possession of Jerusalem, tells me that the time of the Gentiles is beginning to wane, and soon the Jewish people will again be at the forefront of not only world history, but God’s plan right now.

Well, Amir, I want to thank you for joining us today and really thank you for your bold declaration of truth in such a time as this.

Amir Tsarfati: Well, thank you, Tim, thank you, Nathan, for hosting me. I just want to encourage people to stay strong in these days and stay very much close to the Word of God, because the enemy’s out there to deceive in ways that we’ve never seen before. We’re going to see deep faith of people like yourself and even me. If you do not stick to the Bible and to the healthy teaching of the Word, and if you’re not well-versed with Scriptures, you will be easily deceived in these Last Days. So, we have to be very vigilant, and we also have to be very excited. You know, the Bible says that to those who eagerly wait for Him, He will return a second time.

Nathan Jones: Amen. Well, Amir, how can people get in touch with your wonderful ministry, Behold Israel?

Amir Tsarfati: Well, we have a great website, beholdisrael.org, where you can go there and see where our next speaking tours are. You can also sign up for tours, and cruises, and some of our speaking engagements. Telegram, if you go to Telegram, to that app and find my name, and don’t be mistaken, there’s a lot of fake Amirs Tsarfati. Go for the one with over 600,000 subscribers, that’s my channel. You’re going to be updated with news 24/7. Unfortunately, I don’t sleep that much. And we’ve got, you know, a social media presence also.

But you know, the most important thing… Also we have a YouTube channel. The most important thing is that I think it’s important to stay tuned not just with the news, but also with the teachings of the Word, because that’s the thing that matters the most.

Tim Moore: Amir, I certainly hope that our paths will cross in person again soon, either in the land, the Promised Land of Israel, or at the great gathering of the Church when Yeshua Hamashiach, Jesus the Messiah, calls us home.

Amir Tsarfati: Well, thank you. I’m looking forward to seeing you both, and God bless you and your ministry.

Closing

Tim Moore: Well, folks, that is all the time we have for today. I hope our conversation with Amir Tsarfati has been a great blessing to you.

Nathan Jones: And as always, you can access all our resources, including past dialogues with Amir, at christinprophecy.org. You can also visit our online store or call the number on the screen to receive your own copy of The Israel Decree.

Tim Moore: Join us again next week as we explore other topics in Bible prophecy with several experts.
Until then, let’s continue to serve and glorify our promise-keeping Savior and Lord. Godspeed!

End of Program