God Shed His Grace on Thee – 250 Years of Blessing

Discussion

Tim Moore: Well, Nathan, given that we talked about some of the nation’s not existing in their present form, some purists, history purists, would say, “Well, America did not exist in its present form beginning in 1776.” Of course, our current US Constitution was only signed in 19, or excuse me, in 1787 and ratified in 1788. That actually took place, or took effect, in 1789, and yet, most Americans consider July 4th, 1776, as the birthday of America.

Nathan Jones: Yeah, it’s a celebration to think that we are only 250 years old. It seems like a long time, but when you look and see ancient nations, like say China for instance, that’s thousands of years old, the fact that we are still a new country, even though we’re an old country, is something to reflect on.

Tim Moore: Yeah, we are a new country, and yet, again, with our constitutional order, we’re older than China, which in its modern form only dates back to the middle of the 20th century.

Nathan Jones: That’s true.

Tim Moore: We’re almost as old as Great Britain in its parliamentary form of government. And so, we know that this Declaration of Independence, actually predated America’s actual establishment of independence at the end of the War of Independence. That’s a lot of independence. But the war itself that began in April 1775, did not conclude until September 3rd, 1783, with the signing of the Treaty of Paris, where the hostilities between the United States and Great Britain finally came to an end.

I also think it’s important that we reflect, even as we elevate our appreciation for the Declaration of Independence and the truths and its reflection of appreciation and respect for the nature, nature’s God, I should say, we always credit Thomas Jefferson with writing the Declaration, but it was a group of five men who were instrumental in its formulation and its writing.

Of course, Jefferson put pen to paper, but it included not only Thomas Jefferson at age 33, John Adams at age 40, Benjamin Franklin, then at age 70, Roger Sherman, another founding father at age 55, and Robert Livingston at only age 29. This was actually, a group of fairly young men who were enabled to set aside time to craft this declaration to be read or sent over to England.

Nathan Jones: You know, it’s interesting to think that the men who signed the Declaration of Independence really were hanging a noose around their necks, because it set them as enemies of the state. And so, King George would legally have a right, as insurrectionists, to hang them for signing it. So, they put everything on the line to get freedom for the United States.

Tim Moore: Yeah, they pledged their lives, their honor, and their fortune and their sacred honor to that cause. And I also think it’s important that we reflect on some of the misinformation that’s been spread. It’s been widely reported, for instance, that Thomas Jefferson was not a Christian. That he was merely a deist. The same thing is often said about Franklin Roosevelt, or excuse me, Benjamin Franklin, I’m getting my centuries mixed up, Benjamin Franklin.

But here’s what Thomas Jefferson had to say regarding his own role in drafting the Declaration of Independence. He wrote a letter and said, “Believe me, Sir, there is not in the British Empire a man who is more or who more cordially loves a union with Great Britain than I do, but by the God that made me, I will cease to exist before I yield to a connection on terms as the British Parliament proposed. And in this, I think I speak the sentiments of America.”

Already, this young man, 33 years old, recognized the sentiments of America, this institution, he understood to reflect the will of the people here in the colonies at that time, but he also respected the God who made him.

And Benjamin Franklin, another supposed deist, said this as his personal testimony, “Here is my creed. I believe in one God, the Creator of the universe, that He governs it by His providence and that He ought to be worshiped.” And it was Franklin, Benjamin Franklin, who recommended that the constitutional convention, just a decade later, open every daily session with prayer to seek divine guidance to avoid merely groping as it were.

And this is his words, “Groping as it were in the dark to find political truth.” Well, how we wish that we had statesmen of that caliber today.

Nathan Jones: Yeah. It’s interesting that we live in a time period that’s becoming so hostile to God that they want to divorce our Judeo-Christian background. And so, you hear a lot of times where they’ll say, “Well, the founding fathers really weren’t Christians, they were deists.” This idea that there is a God, but He wound up the universe and then He just departed. And so that these guys only believed that there was some deity out there, they didn’t know who He was.

But when you read their writings, they understood it was the God of the Bible. Whether they firmly believed or not, you know, obviously, I think, Benjamin Franklin was the most skeptic, but I love that story, which you just told. Where they met for the continental Congress. I’ve been down there in Philadelphia numerous times. They couldn’t get anything done. There was a lot of infighting and fighting. And then, you know, the most esteem, the elder of all, Benjamin Franklin, stands up and tells them all that, “Hey, we need to turn to God and seek His wisdom.”

And the story goes that after they did that first prayer, it just all came together.

Tim Moore: It really did. And, you know, you can go to the Declaration itself, I referred earlier to their appeal to the laws of nature and nature’s God. Jefferson himself wrote that we are endowed by our Creator with certain unalienable rights.

And in the closing paragraph, he writes again, with this committee of five backing these words, “We, therefore, the representatives of the United States of America,” that’s the first time this appears in print, “in general Congress assembled,” appealing to who? “To the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the name, and by authority of the good people of these colonies, solemnly publish and declare that these united colonies are, and of right ought to be free and independent states.”

And so, this appeal to the Supreme Judge, that doesn’t sound like a deity that just wound up the universe and is totally uninvolved. Even Jefferson recognized that God will judge the world and is involved in the affairs of men to oversee whether or not they are ruling and reigning according to His authority.

Nathan Jones: Absolutely. One of my favorite programs that we did years ago, and this is stretching back in Christ in Prophecy, when we had the legendary Peter Marshall’s son come and his whole ministry was dedicated to bringing the truth to students about the Judeo-Christian heritage of the United States. And so, he taught us why God ordained government.

You know, a lot of people think they want to be anarchists, they want to live their own way, and we’re seeing that increasing. But God wanted orderly and direction. So, what He did is He ordained government to point people to His moral law. And so, it was very important to the founding fathers that that’s what a government existed to do. And when it ceases to do that, when it ceases to represent the people, when it ceases to follow and bring people to the ultimate King, King Jesus, then that government could be overthrown.

And that’s something that when Peter Marshall taught us in that episode, it really opened my eyes to understanding, to justify, because we hear a lot of students today who say, you know, “They overthrew a government. They were just a bunch of radicals. You know, why is that any different than to overthrowing some central American dictator?” It’s because they wanted to institute a government that was God honoring.

Tim Moore: That was God honoring. I think, that is critical to understand, and that’s why it was a biblical position. And they stood on the ground of biblical truth, even as they listed out their offenses that King George and his parliament had enacted on the colonials back in those days. And so, it is a biblically sound position to argue that the American colonies would proclaim their independence.

You know, Nathan, we go back to Scripture and over, over again, whether it’s the writings of Paul, whether it’s Peter in front of the Sanhedrin, they respect the governing authorities until those authorities are in conflict with the rule of God. In other words, they’re going to honor God first.

And Peter even asked at one point, “Who should we obey you or God?” And so, the colonialists obviously said, “We’re going to obey God. We want a government that is going to respect the liberty, the freedoms of the people, and first and foremost of those liberties was the right to worship, the right to express their own opinion.

And so, that’s why we have even the First Amendment to our American Constitution. Well, I think, over the few generations that followed the American Revolution, one of the off-sided remembrances was this idea of a spirit of ’76. What did that really entail?

Nathan Jones: Well, it’s the respect, the providence, and vision that God established that the United States would be a beacon on a hill. You know, we read about this new Jerusalem that’s coming in the future, and they kind of, I don’t know, if they got the interpretation wrong or they’re using it as an example, but they thought of America as this city on a hill, a place where the whole world could look at it and say, “Hey, there’s something different about that nation, that nation points to God.”

And so, when you read the founding documents, even all the way back to the Mayflower Compact, when the pilgrims came to the United States, they wanted to break away from what had become a very corrupted church and mixed with government and just not pointing to God but pointing to man. And they wanted to establish the city on a hill, a beacon to the world that pointed the world to God. And so, that was that spirit of ’76, that excitement that, yes, we’re going to establish one nation under God.

Tim Moore: Most interesting to me is that many of the most fervent advocates of independence and really, American patriots were pastors. Pastors who were not rabble rousers, but pastors who wanted to owe their first allegiance to the Lord God and then subject to that, or subservient to that first and primary allegiance, they wanted a government. A nation that would be serving the Lord and His purposes here on the Earth.

And even George Washington recognized God’s role in America’s founding. Washington wrote this, “The man must be bad indeed who can look upon the events of the American Revolution without feeling the warmest gratitude,” towards who, “the great Author of the universe whose divine interposition was so frequently manifested on our behalf.” Washington recognized we would not be an independent free nation without the intervention of Almighty God.

Nathan Jones: And that’s why when you look at the French Revolution, which was years after our revolution, pretty close, as it was a bloodbath. I mean, it was a murder, a complete annihilation of the government. And when you’ve got Frenchman Alexis De Tocqueville who came to the United States, he was the Minister of Foreign Affairs, and he looked at the Christian aspect of American liberty. He wrote in 1835, his book, Democracy in America, this.

He said, “Upon my arrival in the United States, the religious aspect of the country was the first thing that struck my attention. The Americans combine the notions of Christianity and of liberty so intimately in their minds that it is impossible to make them conceive the one without the other.” And that’s why the American Revolution, though it had its bloody battles, was a completely different type of revolution than the godless or humanistic revolution that happened in France.

Tim Moore: Absolutely so, and even years later, as you’re citing this is what, 50 years after the American, 60 years after the American Revolution, De Tocqueville is still recognizing that Christianity and liberty are so intricately intertwined in America that people cannot conceive of freedom or liberty without Christianity. They go hand in glove. And that’s why today we are in such perilous shape, because people want to have all the liberty, but none of the Christianity, none of the moral or religious overtones that our founders spoke about.

Well, I think, Nathan, you and I would agree that Americans are famously, or dare I say infamously, known to have a strong streak of independence. Now, this is a good thing when it comes to liberty, but often it’s prized as what we call rugged individualism or unfettered liberty as opposed to ordered liberty.

And even some of my heroes seem to be exemplars of this, whether it’s John Wayne with his swagger, a very conservative actor in the last century. Whether it’s Ronald Reagan with rugged individualism, Teddy Roosevelt, they encountered…embodied this idea of rugged individualism, and yet, all of them would not have wanted to undermine Christian faith. Whether they were as outspoken about their faith, they wanted to respect and honor the faith upon which we were founded.

Nathan Jones: Yeah, this rugged individualism didn’t mean it was a divorce from God’s moral law. It was actually in defense of it, pushing back against the evil systems of the world.

One of my great heroes is Ronald Reagan. I think, is one of the greatest presidents in American history. He called the Soviet Union an evil empire, because he saw what it for what it was. It was a humanist empire. It was a godless empire that, if it was meant, if communism was to take over the world, the entire world would be plunged into the dark ages. And so, the work that he did to topple the Soviet Union was a push pushback against evil.

A lot of people think that war itself is an evil thing, but war is a battle between good and evil. And Christians just can’t sit down and not get engaged in the battle. So, these rugged individualists, as you say, these are actually, men of God standing up for what’s right and willing to fight for it.

Tim Moore: Willing to fight for it. And I think, at one point we had leading Americans who understood that even in the past century. If you go back to July 1st, 1957, so that’s not that long ago, the chief justice of the United States Supreme Court, Earl Warren, who had previously been a governor of California, appeared on the cover of Time Magazine. And in the interview that he granted Time, he said this, “I believe that no one can read the history of our country without recognizing that the Good Book,” and he’s speaking of the Bible, “and the spirit of the Savior,” Jesus Christ, “have from the beginning been our guiding geniuses.”

So, he goes on to cite the first charter of Virginia, the charter of New England, and he said, “The same objective is present, a land governed by Christian principles. I believe the entire Bill of Rights came into being, because of the knowledge our forefathers had of the Bible and their belief in it. I like to believe we are living today in the spirit of the Christian religion.” Already he sees that we’re moving away from that actual belief system, but the spirit. And he says, “I also like to believe that as long as we do so no great harm can come to our country.”

Can you imagine, if John Roberts, the current Supreme Court Chief Justice, made that statement today, there’d be many in Congress who would demand his immediate impeachment, because they could not stand the idea of combining church and state with a statement of faith that bold and clear.

Nathan Jones: You know, when I was a kid and I used to read through the Bible, I used to think, “What is wrong with Israel?” You know, God would do these amazing miracles and the people would be so excited about them, and the next generation would be just kind of apathetic. And then the third generation would be lukewarm. And by the fourth generation, they’re in outright rebellion. And then God would put curses on them and they’d call out to the Lord; He’d do something amazing. And that cycle would be all over again.

Well, now that America’s reached its 250th birthday, we could look at periods in American history where our morality started sinking.

Tim Moore: Oh, man.

Nathan Jones: I mean, before the Civil War, before World War I, before World War II, as it is now. And that God would create some kind of enemy, or disaster, or financial upheaval to get the people to get on their knees and bow. And for a brief time, I think, of 9/11, do you remember that?

Tim Moore: Yes, I do.

Nathan Jones: I mean, everybody was in the churches for the first few weeks after 9/11. But quickly the passion for God faded again and we went back in our routine. And Tim, I’d asked a pastor about this once, and I think, he gave me a good example. He says, “It’s like a sine wave.” You know, how sine waves do this? But it’s getting flatter and flatter and flatter as time. I do hope that at some point, God steps in, shakes us up again and gets us back on the right path of being that city on a hill.

Tim Moore: You know, even after 9/11, as you point out, the members of Congress in a bipartisan manner stood on the steps of the Capitol and sang what? They sang “God bless America, land that I love.” And for that one brief moment, they were unified. And of course that, as you said, didn’t last long. And the sine wave continued to descend.

Well, to follow up on Washington’s admonition I read earlier, our own national song says, “O beautiful for spacious skies, for amber waves of grain, for purple mountain majesties above the fruited plain, America! America! God has shed His grace,” His unmerited favor, “on thee and crown thy good with brotherhood from sea to shining sea.”

There was a recognition, that even our blessings were unmerited, but were an outpouring of God’s blessing. So, it still points to Almighty God and our appreciation. That’s what Thanksgiving is supposed to be about. We’ve talked about that as another holiday.

It was George Washington who, again, emphasized the importance of morality, whether it was in the armed forces, whether it was in the nation, but it was the second US President, John Adams, who said, “Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people.” And he didn’t mean religious in the sense of Hindu, or Buddhist, or something else, Christian and Judeo-Christian. And “it is wholly inadequate,” Adams said, “to the government of any other.”

And here we are 250 years later, and it seems like the wheels are coming off, because we don’t have this concept, as I said earlier of ordered liberty, we have unfettered license. So, what is a Christian to make of America as we look at where we stand today? A quarter of a millennium long.

Nathan Jones: I think, you nailed it right on the head there, is that our understanding of liberty is based on now a new generation that’s not as much raised in the Gospel. We have a, as the Bible says in the End Times, a form of godliness, but denies His power. So, what is liberty to most people today? It is anarchy, it’s godlessness, it’s whatever they want to do, that’s liberty, but the Bible never teaches that kind of liberty.

Tim Moore: No.

Nathan Jones: That teaches slavery. Matter of fact, liberty plus morality equals freedom in Christ. But liberty plus immorality will lead to slavery, to Satan. And that’s what our country is misunderstanding. When we have divorced ourselves from the Bible as much as we have, we don’t understand the meaning of liberty anymore. And you’re absolutely right. Unfettered liberty isn’t liberty at all, it’s slavery. We need ordered liberty. Liberty that’s based on morality.

Tim Moore: Well, we’ve talked about Revelation and the letters to the churches. We’ve had long series…

Nathan Jones: Oh yeah.

Tim Moore: Prophecy Chart Series, Overview of the End Times. But the last church represented is Laodicea. And in the Church Age, we believe that that’s where we are today. But this is so applicable in our own nation. And the Lord God says, “I know your deeds. You’re neither hot nor cold. I wish that you were hot or cold, because you were lukewarm, neither hot nor cold. I’ll spit you out.”

See, if this applies to the attitude of America, “Because you say, ‘I am rich and have become wealthy and have need of nothing.’ And you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked.” And the Lord advises this church and the people with this attitude to buy gold from Him that was refined to get white garments. And He says, “I love you. I’m reproving you, because I love you.”

And then He says, “Behold, I stand at the door and knock.” And it’s a message to those who have shut Christ out. He formerly was inside. Now, He’s on the outside knocking to get in. But this smug self-sufficiency, “I don’t need the Lord, I don’t need anything. I’m rich, I have need of nothing,” that seems to describe our own culture, dare I say, our own nation. And it’s tragic, because that’s not where we were founded.

Nathan Jones: Yeah. And we only have to look to Great Britain as the example. A nation that sent more missionaries in the 1800s out than any nation in the world. A nation that was that city on a hill when it came to godliness. But after World War I and World War II, they lost their faith. And to the point now that they’re pretty much being overrun by Islam, because something has to fill that void. What is the British empire today? It’s nothing. It’s just a pale shadow.

We think as Americans, you know, we do have all the blessings of God, but only, if we abide in Him. And the Bible repeatedly teaches us that, abide in Me. If we want to know blessing, abide in Me. And as we pull away, we might see this great power, but it’s propped up right now by trillions of dollars of debt and pride. And it could all come collapsing down unless God is involved.

Tim Moore: Well, Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn came from the Soviet Union. You mentioned the godless empire that Ronald Reagan railed against. And on June 8th, 1978, Solzhenitsyn came to Harvard University. This is shortly after our own bicentennial. And they welcomed him as a hero, because he’d escaped from the Soviet gulag.

But then he said the problem that happened in the Soviet Union was being manifest in America and it was a moral, a religious problem. And he said the same problem in both places is described as simply men have forgotten God. Those intelligentsia did not want to hear that word of religious warning and admonition. And so, they booed him off the stage. And yet, it is so true.

Nathan, I think, it is critical that we recognize we are still hopeful about America. We still love this land; we love this nation. I’ve been told I bleed red, white, and blue. And so, we are Christian patriots. But what can be done, I think, to cite Proverbs 14:34, “We have to recognize that righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a disgrace to any people.” And so, as a whole, yes, we can apply second Chronicles 7:14, “To pray to humble ourselves and pray.”

And we can even individually, Nathan, apply what Daniel did in Daniel chapter nine. And that is to take personal responsibility to intervene personally on behalf of our people and on behalf of our nation, humbling ourselves before Almighty God. And seeking yet another outpouring of His blessing, His unmerited favor, His grace on our land.

Nathan Jones: Yes. And as long as America stands with Israel, the Lord will continue to bless the United States. And I think that’s why we’re seeing a great, great revival, especially since the Charlie Kirk assassination.

A great outpouring as the Trump administration has been working towards helping Israel defend its borders. But it’s a passing of the guard. It’s a changing where we see as Israel rises that the Lord is moving His salvific plan to the Jewish people to be the next great empire that we know will be the primacy, the capital of the world, Jerusalem, throughout the Millennial Kingdom.

So, America’s on the wane and I have a lot of hope for it. I don’t know what nations are going to be in the Millennial Kingdom. We know Israel for sure; the Bible prophesize Assyria, Egypt, and Russia, but those are the only four nations. Will the United States survive and be in the Millennial Kingdom? What are your thoughts?

Tim Moore: Well, I think, that the United States as a nation will survive. Obviously, after the Rapture, many Christians will be removed. And by percentage you could argue that there are more Christians sprinkled in every aspect of a human endeavor here in America than any other country. They will all be removed at the Rapture.

So this country, like all the others, will go into the Tribulation really in abject rebellion against the Lord God and will be judged among all the nations. I dare say we may be judged more harshly than a place like North Korea, because we should have known better.

We’re told in Proverbs 16:18 “That pride goes before the fall.” We’re told in Psalm 146:3 and chapter 20:7, that we should not put our confidence in military, or political leaders, or in military might. And that heartiness, as I just read in Revelation 3, and confidence in self-sufficiency and in riches really is something that the Lord God would admonish.

Nathan, I do, I love this land. I’ll never forget standing at the end of training as a prisoner of war. And I did not experience that in reality. But I went through a training experience in survival, evasion, resistance, escape where we were kept in a prisoner of war camp for a period of time. And in the end, they marched us out and made us stand in formation. And the commandant, who we had come to hate, because he seemed like the antichrist incarnate with all the meanness that he subjected us to, gave a speech where he said, “I want you to turn around in a moment and salute my flag. Who me and my comrades have died for and have bled for, which stands for freedom.”

Well, we thought he was still speaking of the people’s democratic republic of whatever this make believe state that we were being held captive by. But as he gave this speech, a very impassioned speech, of loyalty to his nation, and we literally, were ready to turn around and spit or do something disrespectful.

Instead, we turned around as the American national anthem began playing. And as the Stars and Stripes were lifted up and we realized in that moment that all this training was to make us better prepared to serve this nation. And tears were streaming down the faces of all these cadets who hadn’t slept in days. As we recognize the great privilege that is ours for living in a land of the free, a home of the brave, a nation that God indeed has poured out His grace upon. We have great hope that America will continue to be that shining city on a hill.

Closing

Tim Moore: Only God knows what lies ahead for America. Just as He has revealed what lies ahead prophetically for the whole world.

Nathan Jones: It is right and good to celebrate God’s faithfulness to America over the past 250 years. He’s poured out His blessing after blessing, as the song recognizes, even those blessings are a function of His grace. Perhaps more important, America’s been able to be a conduit of blessing to the world in general and specifically, to Israel.

Tim Moore: We who long for Christ coming, can still be dedicated to seeking the welfare of the city and the nation in which we live. I spent most of my adult life doing just that. First, in the military and then in elected office. My experience has been that those who see the world from God’s perspective apply their service to Christ in ways that enrich this world the most.

Nathan Jones: Gleaming cities of man will inevitably deteriorate over time, but Christian patriots truly see beyond the years to cities that gleam with Heaven’s glorious light and that are eternally undimmed by human tears.

Tim Moore: It is no contradiction to pray “God bless America” even as we long to live under the righteous reign of a truly benevolent Monarch. And until King Jesus returns to set up His Kingdom, our greatest hope is that America would bless God.

Let’s determine to live out that aspiration individually and as a Church–praising and glorifying the God who set us free from sin and gifted us with eternal life in the Kingdom of God.

With that in mind, happy Birthday America–land that we love! Godspeed!!

Narrator: Christ in Prophecy is made possible through the faithful and generous support of viewers like you. Please consider making a donation to Lamb & Lion Ministries so that we can continue broadcasting the message of Jesus’ soon return. Thank you and God bless you.

End of Program