The Book of Revelation: Chapters 10-12

Part 1

Tim Moore: So how about it, fellas, what is your take as we open this chapter 10 and see our Merciful Messiah once again?

Nathan Jones: Well, we’re introduced to an angel. And, like you said, I wrote a whole book on the angels of Revelation. And one of the big contentions is, is this angel we’re going to read about is it Jesus Christ, a description of Jesus, or is a description of a separate angel?

Tim Moore: All right. What do you think, Dave?

David Bowen: Well, I think that he has a rainbow above his head. So I think when you look at this, I think it’s another angel that we’re talking about here. I mean, although you’re the expert in this, I will yield to you on that. But it’s interesting that there’s a scroll involved here as well.

Tim Moore: Another scroll, just like we saw earlier as we began chapter 4.

David Bowen: Yes, so the whole Tribulation began with the opening of a scroll. And now as you move into the second part, the Great Tribulation, we also have a scroll that begins this aspect of the book. I thought that was very interesting.

Nathan Jones: But before he shows the scroll, this angel and I agree with you, I think it’s an angel. Sure, he’s glorious. He has a rainbow over his head. His feet are like fire. And so it’s almost sounds like the description we got of Jesus in chapter 1. But by the time we get here with a loud voice, he’s like a roaring lion. And Jesus has a loud voice. God, like a waterfall. You hear from heaven seven thunders pronounced something. And this is one of these great mysteries of the Book of Revelation. Remember, John was sent to only record what he saw. So he’s like, okay, these seven thunders uttered something and he wants to record it. And sadly, what is said from heaven?

Tim Moore: He’s told not to record it. And that goes back to what I’ve said before, quoting Deuteronomy 29:29, the things which God has revealed belong to us. But there are secrets. There are mysteries that are known only to God. And although I’m very curious by nature, I respect that there are parameters, God says you just don’t have the need to know that. And in the fullness of time, maybe He will reveal those things to us in heaven. But again, my mind could not possibly contain the mind of God. So I’m okay with that too.

Nathan Jones: Well, the fact that the church will be there watching all this happen, I think we’ll get to finally hear what the seven thunders utter because we will be there.

Tim Moore: That’s true.

Nathan Jones: And the question is, what is the identity of the seven thunders? Well, we read earlier about the Sevenfold Spirit, the Holy Spirit. This is the Holy Spirit talking. You know, you never hear the Holy Spirit talk much in the Bible, but here he’s uttering something. But whatever it is, John’s not allowed to record it.

Tim Moore: Okay, so this brings us to the question of this scroll, because as you said, there was a scroll in chapter 4, it represented the title deed of earth held by God the Father able to be opened only by Jesus Christ, the worthy one. This scroll seems different. Are they talking about the same scroll? Is John seeing the title deed of earth brought down by this angel? Or is it something different that he’s told to take and eat?

David Bowen: And again, I’m not sure it matters what scroll it is, it’s the purpose of the scroll. Because when we get back to this, well verse 5 tells it was an angel. So we know it was an angel at the beginning there. But he says that when you look at this scroll, it’s going to be, God’s Word tastes as sweet as honey, but it turns bitter. Ezekiel had this same thing back in Ezekiel. But why is this? And he says, basically what happens here is that we get to the point to where there was silence before, and now we have there is no more delays. No more delays for what? You see the warnings have been coming. The warnings have been coming. Now, God said the warnings are done, now the judgment going to be fulfilled.

Tim Moore: Oh, boy.

David Bowen: And that’s where it turns to bitterness.

Nathan Jones: And that’s exactly what happens to John in verse 10, “And I took the little book out of the angel’s hand.” He’s like I’ve got to eat it, okay. So he eats it. And again, it’s just like you said, it’s sweet as honey, but it turns his stomach sour. And then he’s told you must prophesy again about many people, nations, tongues and kings. So, this is the Word of God about the coming judgments for the rest of the Tribulation, the Great Tribulation. And although, as you said, it’s the Word of God, it’s so wonderful, it’s beautiful, it’s sweet. Once you eat it, the result, the death, the carnage, the destruction, it turns the stomach, it’s bitter.

Tim Moore: Okay, so I will go back to Jeremiah 15:16, who records, “Your words, Lord God, have become for me a joy and the delight of my heart.” The Word of God is such a joy for us. We hunger to read. I love to study the Word of God. And yet there are aspects of it that involve great bitterness. Bitterness for those on the earth who have rejected Christ in particular. Sometimes we find that they are a little bit bitter to us. Jesus said, “in this world you will have trouble.” Wait, I don’t want to hear that. But that’s the truth. And He told us that as He reveals, because He wanted us to recognize that only in Him can we overcome the world, just as He has.

Nathan Jones: And I think this scroll points forward, if you go to verse 15 where we get the seventh trumpet judgment. So, we’ve made it to the midpoint of the Tribulation. We’ve had seven seals, six trumpets. This scroll is about the seventh trumpet, which will release the seven bowl judgments where God’s wrath really cranks up.

Tim Moore: And that’s where the bitterness comes that John recognizes, yes, the Word of God is wonderful and beautiful, but there are aspects of it that become bitter as we digest its meaning, and it’s importance.

David Bowen: But time out. This is prophecy. It’s still in the future.

Tim Moore: It is.

David Bowen: So, we have the judgment. We’re being told that judgments are coming. There’s still time to correct that. There’s still time to receive Jesus. There’s still time.

Nathan Jones: And people in the Tribulation are still getting saved.

David Bowen: Right. So, this again, is prophecy. So, we have hope here.

Tim Moore: At the current moment. I would assert this there is still time now, but there is coming a time when, as is spoken, there will be no more delay for the earth. And quite frankly, there’s an application here even for each person viewing us today, there will be a moment in your life when the Lord says there is no more delay, you have no more time. As I’ve said before, you may be called home, or at least meet your end today, tonight, tomorrow, and so we don’t know how long each of us will linger on the earth. You cannot delay. You have to realize when God says your life is ended, you will ever have chosen wisely already, or you will have sealed your eternal doom if you’ve rejected Christ.

Nathan Jones: And I think that’s why Dr. Reagan’s book, “Wrath and Glory,” is a perfect example of that, because what he’s talking about is sure the wrath of God, but we also see the glory of God through all these judgment. He’s finally dealing with sin. He’s finally dealing with evil. So Dr. Reagan’s commentary on the Book of Revelation is a nice addition to your study of the book of Revelation.

Tim Moore: Another wonderful resource. Yes, another wonderful resource. Well, as a demonstration of God’s mercy and His grace, and the fact that we’re referring to Jesus in this episode as our Merciful Messiah. In chapter 11 we’re introduced to two men who appear on the earth. And we could argue about who they are, a lot of people do, but what’s their purpose?

David Bowen: That’s the most important thing. They go back and forth, but why are they here and what are they doing?

Tim Moore: Okay, so why are they here? What are they doing?

David Bowen: They are warning of the last times, 144,000, their ministry may be over now because God sends these two witnesses here. As he sends, these two witnesses here, they have supernatural power.

Nathan Jones: Interesting. I see the ministry of 144,000 going throughout the entire Tribulation because they’re there in the wilderness also ministering. Whereas we know the two witnesses here are going to be ministering for the first three and a half years of the Tribulation, then killed at the midpoint. And so who are these two witnesses? Why is God whose got 144,000 Jews running around, we haven’t quite gotten to them yet.

Tim Moore: Yeah, and Olivier Melnick likes to say they will be more effective than all you Gentiles have been for 2,000 years.

Nathan Jones: Oh, yeah.

Tim Moore: They’re going to be in your face and telling you about Jesus Christ. And so, I look forward to those 144,000. Not that I’m going to be here. But in the providence of God, they will have an important mission during the Tribulation. So what is different about these witnesses?

Nathan Jones: Well, the 144,000 go out, but the two witnesses stay in Jerusalem. And not only are they witness for God, they have a special prophetic powers, but they also have supernatural power, they can call down fire. It kind of reminds me of when Moses and Aaron went to Pharaoh, and Pharaoh brought his magicians out and they could duplicate some of the miracles Moses did, like turning the staffs into snakes. And that’s what we’ve got, we’ve got the False Prophet and the Antichrist doing false miracles. But then we have the two witnesses speaking for God, doing real miracles.

David Bowen: And as you compare that to the Old Testament, what was the purpose of the plagues? To turn their hearts back to God. They attacked, all the them, well not all, there are many Egyptian gods, but they attacked some of the Egyptian gods, in each one of those plagues. Now, the Egyptians hardened their hearts, the Israelites obeyed God and turned their hearts to Him. And we have the same thing here. They have fire from their mouth. They can shut the sky with no rain. They turn water into blood. They strike the earth with plagues. That’s why you go back to Moses and Elijah, because they had similar ministries like that. However, these are the ways that God, this is His method of disciplining the ones He loved.

Tim Moore: Okay, you mentioned Moses and Elijah those are two names that often are offered up as possibly who these witnesses are. Some will say Enoch and Elijah. Some will say other figures. We have not focused or fixated on their identities. It’s a wonderful parlor game, sort of like figuring out who’s the Antichrist, but that’s not our focus. Instead, I think it’s important to realize their purpose, which is to testify to God. And yet I would submit Nathan, for almost 2,000 years, even Christians thought, wow, how is the entire earth going to hear their preaching and be able to look upon them when they are killed? And yet we take for granted in the modern era how that can happen.

Nathan Jones: Well, Daniel 12:4 said in the end times knowledge would increase and travel would increase. We live in a time period of great knowledge due to computers. People are traveling all over the planet. And so we are at a point now where our technology allows us to just pop on, you know, pull up YouTube and oh, what are the two witnesses doing today? Ah, they burned that guard that was sent to kill them or oh they shut off the rain over this country. And then what do they see? They see the Antichrist finally allowed to murder them. And they’re murdered and they’re dead in the streets for three and a half days. And the people are watching it on their cell phones. They’re watching it over television. They’re streaming. We have the technology today for the whole world to watch. You know what is really debased about society during that time? When the Antichrist is finally allowed, because the Lord only gives them 1,260 days to go out and witness, the Antichrist has them murdered and the people celebrate. There’s a worldwide party. They even give each other gifts.

Tim Moore: You know, I think that’s another important point for us to recognize. I said last week that the Antichrist goes out with authority given to him by God. And you say, why would God give him authority? Just as every prince, and president, and king is given authority by God, so is the Antichrist. His authority is limited, just as Satan’s was in the account of Job, until the three and a half years have passed, and then Lord allows the Antichrist to overcome and to kill the witnesses. You know what? The Lord protects us until He decides that His purpose and plan would take another direction for our lives. And again, I’m okay with that because I submit myself to the will of God. These witnesses obviously do. But while they’re testifying on the earth, boy, are they an annoyance to the Antichrist, an annoyance to all the people who are in rebellion against God. They’re sort of like we are supposed to be today day they’re troublers because they are testifying to the living God, and the world does not want to hear it.

David Bowen: Right, and in contrast, they are worshipping in heaven.

Nathan Jones: Yeah.

David Bowen: The earth is falling apart. The earth is in chaos. All this is happening on the earth. But in heaven, you have the total opposite here. And, Nathan, you brought a point up about technology. When this happens, when they are killed, the whole world watches this live. We didn’t have that technology how many years ago?

Nathan Jones: Yes.

David Bowen: And now we have it. So just for our viewers and people watching this understand the day that we live in, because everything the Antichrist won’t set up his kingdom, it would be there for him. And that’s as you go through this book to understand what’s yet to come, we have to understand the technology is already here in place that’s going to be used in this day.

Tim Moore: It is, but we also leverage that same technology for good.

David Bowen: Oh, sure. Sure.

Tim Moore: And so just like anything else that can be put to bad use or good, we use technology to connect with our viewers. We use technology through our Internet Ministry to make sure that we can reach the entire world with the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

Nathan Jones: But then we see the witnesses get resurrected. So they’re not even buried. They’re left and they’re rotting in the streets.

David Bowen: Disrespect.

Nathan Jones: Yeah, it’s a matter of disrespect. People are walking by and spitting on their corpses. But then the Lord resurrects them, and brings them to heaven, meaning that their message is over. And so we will get to a gospel angel who spreads the Gospel around the earth. But it seems like when God wants to truly punish people, He pulls His Word back. Remember the 400 years of silence between Malachi and Matthew? He was done with the people for that time. They didn’t care about a relationship with Him. And so the witnesses, these two incredible witnesses are silenced. And so that really bodes very poorly for the next three and a half years for the people. And it also is an interesting because the Antichrist was allowed to kill the two witnesses, we know then we move into the next phase where we see war in heaven and Satan cast out of heaven, which is the next step.

Tim Moore: Okay, before we get there, let’s go to that circumnavigating angel. But let’s answer the why. Why does God do this? We’ve called this lesson: Jesus our Merciful Messiah. And He indeed is merciful. As a matter of fact, to cite Habakkuk again in the midst of wrath, He remembers mercy. So he is sending 144,000 evangelist, Jewish evangelists. He’s sending two witnesses. What is the purpose of this circumnavigating angel that tells the world a certain message, Nathan?

Nathan Jones: Well, there’s three angels released, and one of them we call the Gospel Angel. So, people ask, well, how is the gospel going to be preached during the Tribulation if the Church isn’t here? Well, we just read about the two witnesses. Dave mentioned 144,000 Jewish evangelists. I think all this, that maybe someone’s watching the show now, all the materials we leave behind, but God is going to make sure that every person in the Tribulation will have heard the Gospel. So, He sends out the Gospel Angel. And the Gospel Angel declares the eternal message of the Lord, which we believe is the message of salvation. And so by the time the Tribulation is over every single person on the planet will be evangelized. Now, whether they accept it or not, that’s a different story.

Tim Moore: The same as today. People are accepting or rejecting. And really God’s goal is that none would perish, but all would turn to Him for salvation. And yet some reject that.

David Bowen: But when you look at this too, I’ve got to ask the question how much more can God do? He sends these two witnesses here, fire comes from their mouths, there’s no rain, he turns water to blood, he strikes the earth. How much more can God do to get His message across?

Tim Moore: Reminds me of the person standing on the roof waiting for a rescue. And a boat comes and a helicopter comes, and they reject that and say, “No, I’m waiting for God to rescue me.” And finally, they drown. They say, “Why didn’t you rescue me?” He said, “I sent a boat. I sent a helicopter. What more do you want?” In other words, God has always given ample opportunity and so none have an excuse if they reject the Lord. Well, obviously, in the end of chapter 11, we get to the seventh trumpet, which foretells of Jesus reign. It is finally time and coming up very quickly for Jesus to reign on the earth. But Chapter 12 seems to be an allegorical aside. There are a lot of symbols, and even as literalist, how do we make sense of chapter 12 with a woman, a red dragon, a male child, and this war in heaven?

Nathan Jones: Well, because even in the seventh trumpet judgment, you see the ark, it says the ark of His covenant, verse 19 was seen in this temple. Is that the earthly ark that the people carried around, or is that the representation of the altar that’s before the throne of God? So, we have to look at symbols in their proper context here. This is probably not the Ark of the Covenant from the Old Testament. This is the ark, the real representation that the one is a shadow of. So we come to the story which is called to the great sign of Revelation 12. It’s about a woman, and a child, and a dragon. A woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, which is a symbol for that, if you go back to Joseph as a representative of Israel. On her head was a garland of 12 stars. She gives birth to a child, and then a dragon comes and tries to destroy the child. So, we believe that the woman is Israel, the child is Jesus the Messiah, and the dragon is Satan trying to destroy the Messiah.

Tim Moore: Absolutely.

David Bowen: Now what’s very interesting. I agree with everything you just said. In fact, when I write in my book we go back to the Old Testament revealing the Old Testament. You’ve got to understand the rest of the book to understand this part of the book?

Nathan Jones: Yeah, Revelation really is like the final exam of the Bible.

David Bowen: But here John writes about this. We know that the woman is Israel, and Israel gives birth to the Messiah. We know that going back to Joseph’s dream, I agree with you about that. But John in his gospel does not talk about the nativity, does not talk about the Christmas story. There’s no shepherds, there’s no magi. But here he does. And when he brings the nativity, the woman giving birth to the Messiah, Christmas, here he does and he adds another character, the red dragon, the Devil. So, he brings the Devil into the nativity scene who’s waiting, the dragon stood in front of the of the woman waiting to devour for the birth. This goes back to Herod trying to kill the babies in Bethlehem. So, John doesn’t bring it in his gospel, but he does bring the Christmas story in a different way in the book of Revelation.

Nathan Jones: Interesting.

Tim Moore: You know, this is I said allegory, this is truth revealed in yet another means. And so the woman clearly pointing back to Joseph’s dream representing Israel, the 12 tribes, the 12 stars, again, back to some of Joseph’s dreams in Genesis, the male child, Jesus, who is the culmination and really one of the primary purposes of Israel being called out and chosen by God to bring to us not only the Scriptures, not only a demonstration of being in covenant relationship with God, but to bring us the Messiah.

Nathan Jones: Plus the dragon, we know is Satan because He wipes a third of the stars out. That’s a reference to when Satan tried to overthrow God.

Tim Moore: Certainly is.

Nathan Jones: A third of the demons or angels were cast out and became demons. And this is interesting too, because we’ve got another war that’s happening here, because this is then goes on to explain how Satan one last time tries to overthrow Jesus in heaven, because he’s allowed access to the throne of God. He’s kicked out. He comes down and he possesses the Antichrist and that begins the Great Tribulation. His wrath is to destroy all the Jewish people.

Tim Moore: So, Satan is enraged because he no longer has access to heaven. And that blows my mind that he does right now. But we’ve made it clear throughout the series that he does have access, and yet we’re told at some point he does not. I want to for a moment just land on the importance of Israel, because you said the Tribulation turns attention to Israel beginning in chapter four. But here we see it dramatically that Israel is a living testimony of God’s grace. I’ve heard people say, why is God still favoring the Jews? They don’t deserve it. My answer is always, well, neither do you. Neither do I. None of us do. That’s the Gospel message. And that’s a sign of God’s faithfulness and His commitment to His promise to bless the hereditary descendants of Abraham, that being Israel. Israel also bears witness to the benefits of keeping the commandments of God and of rejecting the testimony of Jesus, how discipline is poured out. And that is why Israel is also hated by Satan, because they are a conduit of God’s blessing, and because if Satan could ever annihilate and destroy the Jews, then he would prove God a liar. Which is what he claimed in Genesis, God is a liar. No, we know better than that.

Nathan Jones: That’s a good point. It’s an interesting verse in verse 12, of course Satan being cast out of heaven, heaven says, “Rejoice, o heavens, and you who dwell in them.” Yay, he’s gone. “But woe to the inhabitants of the earth and the sea for the Devil has come down to you having great wrath.” Because why? He knows that his time is short. He knows Bible prophecy. He knows he only has three and a half years. And he knows that Jesus comes when the Jewish people cry out for the Messiah to come rescue them. If you can kill all the Jewish people, the Messiah can’t come back.

David Bowen: And it says that he protects the woman in verse 13. He protects the woman.

Tim Moore: He being God.

David Bowen: He being God, right, the woman is protected here, who gives birth to the male child, Israel giving birth to Messiah. He protects her, for times, times and a half, so we get the three and a half year period in there with that as well. And the earth will open up, the woman is escaping away from that. You know, I just cannot wait for our Jewish brothers and sisters to read the Book of Revelation.

Nathan Jones: Yes.

David Bowen: Because they’re going to see so much of God in here, because they don’t read the New Testament in general, they don’t understand this. Gentiles don’t understand the Old Testament. So don’t we don’t get the stories. But when they see, they’re going to see God’s hand in this so much.

Tim Moore: They certainly will.

David Bowen: Because you go back to Exodus with what happened there, how God protected Israel in Exodus.

Tim Moore: We’re told that two-thirds of the Jewish people will be killed.

David Bowen: Yes, Zechariah.

Tim Moore: And that’s heartbreaking. And our friend Olivier Melnick said that it breaks his heart, but his wife pointed out the Lord never gave a number. And so, the more Jewish people that we can share the Gospel with and will accept Christ as their Jewish Messiah now, the more will be saved from the wrath to come. They will be raptured as part of the Church. And so that percentage can be a dwindling number. If more and more Jews will turn to Christ. I pray that is happening today.

Nathan Jones: That why I’m hoping that 8 billion that are alive now, 4 billion in Tribulation, hopefully a billion of them are raptured. So it’s the 7 billion.

Tim Moore: Yeah, the numbers are lower. Well, in a very real sense, I believe Israel represents and stands as a prophetic time clock. And in the context of Revelation chapter 12, it offers a parenthetical, I think, perspective on the role of Israel, the animosity of Satan and the assurance of Jesus inevitable victory. Amen.

Closing

Tim Moore: We began this episode by commenting on how last week’s discussion of the Lamb’s wrath was so heavy. The truth often is weighty, and the tragedy of so many people falling into the hands of an angry God, as Jonathan Edwards famously preached, is heartbreaking. Chapters 10-12 offers a respite from that aspect of the Tribulation and reemphasize God’s great mercy.

David Bowen: It is as if the narrative of Revelation adheres to Habakkuk’s prayer that we talked about in the last episode, in the midst of wrath remember mercy. Jesus wanted to remind John and us that why there is righteous judgment and God’s just wrath, He also desires for sinners to come to the end of themselves and to turn to Him in repentance, even in the midst of the Tribulation.

Nathan Jones: Well, I can’t imagine shaking my fist at God, especially when people are being killed and judgments are being poured out from heaven. And it is common knowledge that it is all due to the wrath of Him who sits on the throne and of the Lamb.

Tim Moore: But we could say the same thing right now. Why do some people encounter challenges that drive them into Jesus loving arms while others experience hardship and curse the Lord?

Nathan Jones: I suppose it’s like what Billy Graham used to say, “The same sun that melts the butter, hardens the clay.” Our prayers are that anyone watching today will soften their heart and not harden it. Pastor Dave, how can a person demonstrate true repentance and come humbly before our great God and Savior and receive eternal life?

David Bowen: Well, I think you just summed it up. Humble yourself, and recognize your own sinfulness. There is no way that you can earn your way into heaven any more than the three of us could. At the same time, there is nothing that can separate you from the love of God or put you beyond His grace, mercy, and forgiveness. If you will come to Him, simply pray, “Lord Jesus, I’m a sinner, but I believe that you gave yourself as a perfect sacrifice for my sin. I trust in you alone for my salvation. And I thank you for loving me enough to take the punishment of death that I deserve. I look forward to spending eternity worshiping you.”

Tim Moore: Well said, Dave. Well, Nathan, many of our viewers have long expressed a desire for us to take a deep dive into Revelation. Tell them how they can dive even deeper than we can during this TV series.

Nathan Jones: Well, sure. If you want to expand your study of Revelation, visit our online store or call the number on the screen to order our new and updated overview of Revelation Study Guide. It’s designed to accompany a verse-by-verse audio series recorded by Dr. Reagan.

Tim Moore: Folks we’ve also uploaded additional content to accompany each of these Christ in Prophecy episodes on Revelation from Prophetic Perspectives, to commentary articles, to Deep Dives with Pastor Dave. And we’ve added a link so you can also order Dave Bowen’s extensive study of Revelation.

David Bowen: Wow, well, thanks for the plug there, Tim. I know that all our resources will offer a great blessing to those who want to dive deeper into Revelation.

Tim Moore: As we’ve said before, we hope our conversations throughout this series whet your appetite for God’s prophetic Word. Even more important, we hope they offer you hope in this dark hour and encourage you to eagerly anticipate our soon coming King. In the oft repeated words of our founder, David Reagan, we pray that you will look up, and be watchful, or straighten up and lift up your head, for our redemption is drawing near. Godspeed!

End of Program